Black Mesa v1.0
- Thread starter Dungeoncrawler
- Start date
I prefer the setting of HL1 over HL2. Actually, between HL2, the episodes, and Alyx, I'm pretty burned out from City 17. Give us a new and different setting! I absolutely loved the Arizona underground military complex stuff, but it's prolly time to move us to some new scenary. Maybe something really original, like NYC overtaken by jungle and covered by a giant glass dome?
In terms of gameplay, HL2 is clearly more refined, less frustration, etc. I'm sure this was a product of TONS of user testing... I remember Gaben mentioning that he wanted a game that even his mom could finish, and if they found parts of the game that test users got stuck on, they'd rework it. The result is a pretty linear action experience, designed for everyone to be able to win.
HL1 has alot more open-feeling gameplay. Larger, more interesting arenas, offering more interesting enemy AI that appears to flank you, etc. I really felt like I had to work to out-think the enemies (in HL2 I just run straight in and shoot everyone in the head), having to utilize the various traps, grenades, and weapons, to survive. However, HL1 also has less overall polish, more frustration, some confusing level designs, etc. I'm sure there's a much smaller % of gamers who ever finished HL1.
HL2 brings many novel (at the time) features, most notably physics-based-gameplay, the gravity gun, WAAAAY more scripted sequences with NPCs, and high-water-mark production values. Most of these have become standard in the decades following, and done better by newer games... modern gamers might find little of interest in playing HL2 for the first time. Whereas HL1, despite it's flaws, may stand up better as a leader of it's 90s era.
Honestly I think HL2's weakest point, imo, is just the fact that Valve never bothered to finish it. It's very disappointing that they fizzled out before concluding Ep3. HL1 feels more like a full complete package, and that's a major advantage.
In terms of gameplay, HL2 is clearly more refined, less frustration, etc. I'm sure this was a product of TONS of user testing... I remember Gaben mentioning that he wanted a game that even his mom could finish, and if they found parts of the game that test users got stuck on, they'd rework it. The result is a pretty linear action experience, designed for everyone to be able to win.
HL1 has alot more open-feeling gameplay. Larger, more interesting arenas, offering more interesting enemy AI that appears to flank you, etc. I really felt like I had to work to out-think the enemies (in HL2 I just run straight in and shoot everyone in the head), having to utilize the various traps, grenades, and weapons, to survive. However, HL1 also has less overall polish, more frustration, some confusing level designs, etc. I'm sure there's a much smaller % of gamers who ever finished HL1.
HL2 brings many novel (at the time) features, most notably physics-based-gameplay, the gravity gun, WAAAAY more scripted sequences with NPCs, and high-water-mark production values. Most of these have become standard in the decades following, and done better by newer games... modern gamers might find little of interest in playing HL2 for the first time. Whereas HL1, despite it's flaws, may stand up better as a leader of it's 90s era.
Honestly I think HL2's weakest point, imo, is just the fact that Valve never bothered to finish it. It's very disappointing that they fizzled out before concluding Ep3. HL1 feels more like a full complete package, and that's a major advantage.
theshadowcult
New member
The episodes werent in city 17, only hl2 and alyx were. You spend more time out of city 17 then you do in it collectively by a lot.
If I recall, Ep1 was set entirely in city 17. The game concludes with you hopping on a train to escape city 17. It's only ep2 that's outside the city, and it's still on the outskirts.
Jet Black
New member
I have played Titanfall 2, but there is something different and "old school" about Black Mesa that makes it feel very Half-Life 1. I think it's that there are things you can do or need to do that just aren't outright stated to you like "Hey Cooper, you need to travel forward and backward in time to do X or Y..."
I mean CoD is sort of the same corridor-shooting type game, but it isn't the same and doesn't give the freedom to explore and break levels and pick **** up and move it around like Half-Life did. Valve was always good at that. Similar to the old Ultima games where you could interact with stuff but it wasn't necessary.
Could just be me, but that's how it makes me feel anyway.
azalea
CS:GOne to hell
Yeah, and I think a lengthy segment was set in the combine citadel itself.
Fuku2
Well-known member
That might be your age playing tricks on the keyboard.Yeah. Trying to get off of the ladder in the elevator shaft and falling every time.
That was the first part of ep 1. G and A had to go back into the citadel to reactivate the containment field to keep it from blowing up before they could get out of town.
Nagorak
Well-known member
I think I liked it because it was shorter and I liked the concept of playing one of the security guys. It wasn't so grandiose in its vision, as I recall. You're basically a security guard thrown into a **** situation that you have to try to get out of.
With that being said, it's been a long time since I played, so my memory could be faulty.
The fact that HL2 is not finished makes me hesitate to recommend it to anyone. As you said in the other part of your post that I cut out, a lot of the innovative stuff in HL2 became standard fare so it hasn't aged that well. The story of the main game also wasn't that fleshed out, it was more take a tour of strange places. That being said, the episodes were great, but they're not finished, so what the **** is the point?
Everyone still loves Valve for some reason, but they are permanently on my **** list for not finishing the game. Whatever else they've done, the failure to finish the trilogy showed a great deal of contempt for their fans/supporters. Just abandoning a project like that, for no legitimate reason (i.e. running out of money), is something that you just don't do. It's clear that they had grown to have a "we don't owe you anything" attitude, and in fact that was not true, they did owe us an ending for having purchased the main game and the two previous episodes.
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Jet Black
New member
Yeah. Trying to get off of the ladder in the elevator shaft and falling every time.
Haha... there is that, but at least it has one-button quicksaves. Another old-school feature.
NIGELG
.
This is an excellent post that sums up how I feel about Valve not concluding the series.
They have no proper reason not to finish Half Life.
Jet Black
New member
Have you played Half-Life Alyx? I think they intend to go on with the series, but the end of that game drastically changed the outcome of Half-Life 2: Episode 2. They likely can avoid a traditional Half-Life 3 and go sideways but forward at the same time.
NIGELG
.
If they release it as a non VR game I might bite.
John C Flett
Veteran of Psychic Wars
I'm kind of on the fence with what you say. I agree with a lot but I never bought into this "they owe us" mindset. When I bought each of the previous games I got what was owed to me. When I was given Alyx I got more than was owed to me.
As much as I like the idea of another HL the bar that has been set is so high it will probably be a let down and faced with the choice of too few games but excellent memories or the choice of watching it milked 'til it becomes another worn out has-been I'm not sure the present situation isn't better. I'd rather only have a new game if they can really knock it out of the park.
As much as I like the idea of another HL the bar that has been set is so high it will probably be a let down and faced with the choice of too few games but excellent memories or the choice of watching it milked 'til it becomes another worn out has-been I'm not sure the present situation isn't better. I'd rather only have a new game if they can really knock it out of the park.
Jet Black
New member
I doubt that will happen. In fact I expect that the next Half-Life game will also be VR.
John C Flett
Veteran of Psychic Wars
I'd be onboard for that but it would tick a lot of people off. A smarter move might be HL3 in pancake and a seperate Alyx sequel for VR. Hopefully sometime in my lifetime.
demo
space cadet
As much as I loved Alyx in VR, I do hope HL3 is pancake.
I disagree. If each game was a complete package/story, then that would be fine. But the way they ended ep2 on a cliffhanger, that it simply was not a complete story, they had a moral obligation to release ep3.
acroig
Just another Troll
While I agree with you I think they really fear a Mess Effect 3 backlash and they have too much to lose at this point.