CCC not working (Windows 8.1)

[sygnus21]

Hi all,

I typically don't have issues with AMD's drivers to include Catalyst Control Center but I notice the last two beta updates 14.6 & 14.6 RC2 has cause some strange issues were CCC refuses to work.

The first time this occurred I just did what I normally have done for countless years, just install the drivers overs the current ones - no issues, all is good. However this time, CCC simply refused to work or even show up in the notification area. I wound up uninstalling everything, including registry entries, then reinstalling the 14.6 beta drivers to solve the issue.

Fast forward today... updating to the 14.6RC 2 drivers resulted in the same issue... CCC not working. This time, I just did a System Restore to roll back to the old 14.6 beta driver and all is good now.

Anyone else seen this and know what's going on? Interestingly enough, I didn't experience any problems with the 14.4 WHQL drivers.

BTW my GPU is a R9-280X Sapphire Vapor X, Windows 8.1, Haswell system.

You can also see others complaining about the same issues here - http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-1948890/amd-catalyst-control-center-work-win.html. Again, the only time I've experienced this is with the beta drivers

Thanks.

 

[shadow001]

Had the exact same problem and I needed to use AMD's uninstall utility to fully remove the old 14.4 driver set and install the 14.6 RC2's....As a side note, not only does CCC work but also the raptor game utility too.

Took 3 tries to work, so the drivers are finicky to say the least.

 

[sygnus21]

Well ironically this time the issue was much easier to fix. After doing a system restore all I did was go to programs and features and use the Catalyst Install Manager to express remove everything including itself, reboot then install the 14.6RC2 drivers and all was good. CCC now working.

I did get a notification after the install was complete telling me there were issues, but a reboot showed no problems as CCC is now working and also showing in the notification area.

Unfortunately this didn't work with the last beta drivers I tried as noted in my initial post. Weird, but all is good now.

Thanks.

 

[WaltC]

Well ironically this time the issue was much easier to fix. After doing a system restore all I did was go to programs and features and use the Catalyst Install Manager to express remove everything including itself, reboot then install the 14.6RC2 drivers and all was good. CCC now working.

I did get a notification after the install was complete telling me there were issues, but a reboot showed no problems as CCC is now working and also showing in the notification area.

Unfortunately this didn't work with the last beta drivers I tried as noted in my initial post. Weird, but all is good now.

Thanks.

No problems with the 14.6b or the RC2, but...

Yes, I had severe problems in *uninstalling* the 14.4WHQL's believe it or not! I didn't have any problems with the CCC in any of them--except when I had to install one driver set again on top of itself--because for some reason the install didn't complete the first time! It was, again, one of the 14.4b set. With the 14.4WHQLs I could uninstall them but on reboot my system was hosed--unusable because all USB ports were dead--no keyboard, no mouse. It happened *six* times total, including this last time with the 14.4WHQLs that AMD posted had been fixed of "install" problems. In every case, System Restore was my only way out. I've deleted all of the 14.4's.

Beginning with the 14.6's, though--Win8.0 is no longer supported--at all--as the newer drivers dropped WDDM 1.2 support and now only support WDDM 1.3 in 8.1. I'd lay odds these problems have been caused by making that transition, somehow. It seems to have caused differing problems for people--and for some people, no problems at all, evidently. Odd.

 

[shadow001]

The screens on my system shut down completely right after it booted up, and I wanted to check outlook for mails( 14.6 RC's installed), and I couldn't even bring up task manager at all, I had to hard restart the system to see anything on the displays.


Whatever they did with this driver set, seems my displays don't like it at all, and I still get a split second flickering every now and then, so back to the 14.4's I go.

 

[Dyre Straits]

Installing OTT hasn't caused me any problems in quite some time now.

I generally only uninstall if going to a previous version.

 

[kakarot]

Good idea to use ddu or driverfusion here and there. kinda nuts to just install over older sets but that's just my opinion. Also a good idea to right-click and install as admin on win8.1.

 

[WaltC]

Good idea to use ddu or driverfusion here and there. kinda nuts to just install over older sets but that's just my opinion. Also a good idea to right-click and install as admin on win8.1.

Good point about admin mode! I do so often reflexively that it never occurs to me that some people might not do that--should always use admin mode to install software, imo.

 

[kakarot]

Yup. On 7 it wasn't really necessary when logged in as an admin but it's a must on 8

 

[shadow001]

Now with the 14.4 WHQL's, I haven't had an issue at all for the past 2 days, so I think i'll wait for the WHQL's of the 14.6 driver set before even attempting updating drivers.

 

[sygnus21]

Good point about admin mode! I do so often reflexively that it never occurs to me that some people might not do that--should always use admin mode to install software, imo.

There's really no need to do this unless you don't have admin rights. This is the point of having admin rights. I've installed all sorts of stuff on Vista, 7, 8, & 8.1 and outside of UAC, I've never had to use admin rights (mode). Why?.... because I already had them.

Going back to the issue... I normally just update the drivers over the old ones but it seems these beta drivers need you to uninstall the old ones first. At least that's how it work for me once I did a system restore and started all over again.

 

[WaltC]

There's really no need to do this unless you don't have admin rights. This is the point of having admin rights. I've installed all sorts of stuff on Vista, 7, 8, & 8.1 and outside of UAC, I've never had to use admin rights (mode). Why?.... because I already had them.

Going back to the issue... I normally just update the drivers over the old ones but it seems these beta drivers need you to uninstall the old ones first. At least that's how it work for me once I did a system restore and started all over again.

Yea, that *is* a theory... Unfortunately, especially with a lot of older software (and some newer stuff, too, I've noticed), some programs will not run properly unless you run them in Admin mode--even if you are the Admin and the sole account on the 'puter. Game forums are full of people suddenly discovering the use for "run as admin" and finding out that programs they couldn't get to run without it run fine under admin mode. Windows 8 also has some heavier restrictions on c:\ root and c:\program files(x86) that make them less amenable to program installs, even if you are signed on as admin--without specifically running the installs as admin.

To better illustrate the point, there are several routine file copying/pasting/deleting things you can do in Win8 even though you are running the only admin account on the 'puter that *still* ask you for permission as admin... I get those requesters regularly.

Besides, if you are running under an account *without* admin privileges, then selecting "run as admin" won't do anything, will it?... I never run anything less than an admin account, so I don't know for certain, but it surely makes sense to me--otherwise a less-than-admin-rights account wouldn't be secure at all. IE, you can only "run as admin" if you already have admin privileges. If you don't have admin privileges then you can never run anything as an admin--makes sense, no?

 

[kakarot]

Definitely not true sygnus21. Quick search reveals tons of issues people have not installing and/or running apps as an admin even tho they are logged in as one and have already disabled UAC. For example, apps like teamspeak and other voip's

 

[sygnus21]

Definitely not true sygnus21. Quick search reveals tons of issues people have not installing and/or running apps as an admin even tho they are logged in as one. For example, apps like teamspeak and other voip's

So let's be clear here... there is a difference between UAC (User Account Control) and an Administrator Account (admin rights).

Yes... UAC will prompt for the user to allow access to Windows; however, if you DO NOT have admin rights, you will be notified that you do not have sufficient privileges to install a software or perform certain functions.

With that, many make the mistake of thinking UAC and admin rights are one in the same which they are not.

To simplify.... UAC may kick in to ask if you give programs permission to modify the system, and if you have full admin rights, clicking OK on the UAC prompt will allow to program to proceed. However, if you DON'T have admin rights, you will instead be told you don't have permission to modify the system. That's the difference, and why I said what I said.

Also note that you can configure UAC to never prompt for permission to install stuff (disable UAC), however you STILL must have admin rights to install stuff. In short, even with UAC disabled, you'll still need admin rights to install, uninstall, or perform certain functions/procedures under Windows. UAC is used on Vista, 7, 8/8.1 and most probably most of todays Windows server OS's but I wouldn't know about those as I've not played with those (yet).

Think of UAC as a "are you sure you want to do this" function, whereas Admin rights is a "you can't do this without permission" function... even if you said yes to UAC.

Hope this clarifies.

 

[kakarot]

You're right but the thing is that when on windows 8+ even tho you are an admin and UAC is disabled neither is really true as in if you did the same on win7. UAC on windows 8+ cannot be fully disabled as in 7 unless you go through the registry and even then I am pretty sure you kill anything Metro in the process. Also launching or installing stuff on windows 8 admin is not the same as on windows 7 admin accounts.

There is a very easy way to check this as well. While logged in to windows 7 and 8 as an admin just open a cmd prompt. On 7 you will see that it tells you that all commands will run with full admin rights. On windows 8+ however it does not and they will not. That is unless you specify that you want to run cmd as admin by right clicking and selecting run as admin even tho you are one.
So no, installing and running apps as an admin on windows 8+ does not offer them same admin privileges as it use to on 7.

 

[sygnus21]

UAC on windows 8+ cannot be fully disabled as in 7 unless you go through the registry and even then I am pretty sure you kill anything Metro in the process. Also launching or installing stuff on windows 8 admin is not the same as on windows 7 admin accounts.

1 - I am currently using Window 8.1 and you CAN disable UAC (i.e. set it to Never notify me) under your user account. You can also see our tutorial here at Eightforums - User Account Control (UAC) - Change Settings in Windows 8. I'm also a member of the forum as well as Vista and sevenforums and have been a member of these sites since 2008, same name - sygnus21

2 - UAC and Admin rights basically work the same whether Vista, 7, 8 or 8.1. Yes, there may be some slight variations in the way UAC works internally, but it basically serves the same function... to insure you know something is about to happen to your system - again, the "are you sure you want to do this" nag feature. This is why many disable UAC - something I don't recommend as it also serves as a security feature.

3 - With regards to Command prompt, under Windows 7 it is advisable to right click and use Admin when performing certain functions. Under Windows 8.1 you have both the standard and Admin Command prompt links. Right click the Start button on 8.1 and you will see two command prompts.

 

[kakarot]

You misunderstand. Unlike vista and 7, setting the slider to never notify does not completely disable UAC. Metro apps will not run with UAC completely disabled which can only be done via the registry or running in built-in admin account/mode(full always elevated). Its also the reason you still get some crappy access prompts when attempting to access some folders for the first time even tho you are an admin and uac is set to never notify.

But bud, I'm not arguing with you. I'm just wondering why you would not want to install your trusted drivers with full elevated privileges by manually selecting run as admin. Why even risk installing important drivers with unelevated privileges when its so easy not to?



Edit- With start8 i never see that but there is only one cmd.exe. the link in the start button just allows you to run it with unelevated and elevated admin rights.

 

[sygnus21]

You misunderstand. Unlike vista and 7, setting the slider to never notify does not completely disable UAC. Metro apps will not run with UAC completely disabled which can only be done via the registry or running in built-in admin account/mode(full always elevated). Its also the reason you still get some crappy access prompts when attempting to access some folders for the first time even tho you are an admin and uac is set to never notify.

I think my point is being completely missed here.... that is that there are two functions affecting the installation of programs.... UAC and Admin rights, and that they are not one in the same, but separate entities. That rather than rehash what I said, I urge you to re-read the posts. I not interest in going to the inner most working of the functions between Vista, 7, 8 or 8.1 because it has no bearing on the basics of what's being said.

With regards to this....

But bud, I'm not arguing with you. I'm just wondering why you would not want to install your trusted drivers with full elevated privileges by manually selecting run as admin. Why even risk installing important drivers with unelevated privileges when its so easy not to?

As I've explained... there's no need to do so if you've already got full admin rights. All you need to do is click OK to the UAC if prompted

And not trying to be funny but I don't understand what you're not getting here. Re-read what I said, and look at the links posted. Bottom line if you have a PC with full admin rights, other than being nagged by UAC, you should have no problem installing software. I've installed hundreds of programs on various OS's with UAC and have never had an install issue. BTW I've been building my own systems since 98 so it's not like I don't know how to give myself admin rights. You can see my system specs, profile and rig here.


And as for the Command prompts...

Edit- With start8 i never see that but there is only one cmd.exe. the link in the start button just allows you to run it with unelevated and elevated admin rights.

if you're actually using an unmodified version of Windows 8.1 as I am, you'd see two command prompts (one with Admin rights, and one without) when you right click the "start" button on the lower left hand side of the OS. It's the one that looks like the new Windows logo. You can see what's on the start button here, under the heading "Additional Details and POWER.

Peace

 

[WaltC]

...



As I've explained... there's no need to do so if you've already got full admin rights. All you need to do is click OK to the UAC if prompted

Yes, and as I explained, you can only "run as Admin" if you *already have admin rights*...

You cannot "run as Admin" if you don't. Obviously. [I am not sure if you grasp the significance of this as it relates to what we are discussing...]

I also pointed out how with Win8 things are a bit different than they are in Win7--there are several normal copy/paste/delete actions relative to C:\ which throw up requesters plainly stating, "This activity requires Admin permission"--and you get those requesters even when the only account on the machine you are running is an Admin account...

Then there are differences relative to C:\ root and c:\program files (x86) as well, in Win8 with regard to providing admin permission over and above--regardless of--the permissions inherent in the account you are running. These things have nothing to do with UAC as you are specifically asked for "Admin permission"--even though you are already the Admin. IE, turn off UAC and you will still get the requesters asking for Admin permissions, which, again, you cannot give *unless* you already are running under an Admin account.

Also, remember that UAC is just an alarm system checking back with the user to verify that he is the one responsible for running the program. "UAC" has no "rights" per say in an account--it's just an added layer of security, that's all. It doesn't mimic or take the place of Admin rights, etc. You can turn off UAC, and attempt to open a program via "run as admin" and if you do not have the install rights you will not be allowed to install the program whether you see a UAC prompt or you don't (ie, the result is the same whether UAC is off or on.)

IIRC, the original poster made it clear he was talking specifically about Win8, which is what I responded to.

But to be clear, some programs want to "do things" relative to memory management and file opening/writing that the most recent OSes require the operating account to have specific rights to do--even if you are running an Admin account. If you do not select "run as Admin" when you run these programs then the program simply won't run, is what happens--nothing relating to UAC--the program simply won't run--the symptom I see is usually just a blank screen. I click through the UAC requester and say "Yes" to running the program, but since I didn't not select "run as Admin" to run the program--it will stall and do nothing...until, I try again, this time selecting "run as admin"--I click "Yes" on the UAC prompt but then the program runs!

Again, game forums are full of people running admin accounts with UAC turned off in most cases (something they did to try and get the program to run) but the program just won't run--until they right-click on the program exe icon and select "run as admin"--and then the program runs. It's surprising you haven't seen this before...In these cases simply running under an Admin account is insufficient--you must *also* select "run as admin"...I really don't know why Microsoft does it that way, except that I think it's just another layer of security.

 

[kakarot]

We've destroyed this thread no doubt lol. But really, with the command prompt alone you are making my point bud. What you are seeing in the start button are "run" and "run as admin" for the same exact cmd.exe (aka the command prompt) located in your System32 folder. There is only one command prompt.
Now why would I actually have to specify I want to run that .exe as an admin if I am already one? Simple answer is that you are never a true admin in the same sense as you were in windows xp unless you are logged in to the built-in admin account which is hidden by default.
It's the only reason I recommend installing important drivers and apps with full elevated permissions, aka "run as admin".
Not saying that i know how this sh*t works but its silly to say "run as admin" does nothing simply because you are logged in as one in vista or newer

Found this that can shed some light on this for us;

Unlike earlier versions of Windows, when an administrator logs on to a computer running Windows 7 or Windows Vista, the user’s full administrator access token is split into two access tokens: a full administrator access token and a standard user access token. During the logon process, authorization and access control components that identify an administrator are removed, resulting in a standard user access token. The standard user access token is then used to start the desktop, the Explorer.exe process. Because all applications inherit their access control data from the initial launch of the desktop, they all run as a standard user.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc709691(WS.10).aspx