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Old Nov 19, 2020, 01:57 PM   #1
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Default Official Navi2x/6x00 series thread

Specs and numbers and benches pls and thanks

Lets try and keep this civil pls
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 03:07 PM   #2
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Specs and numbers and benches pls and thanks

Lets try and keep this civil pls
I suspect with time, because of AMD's iron grip on the console market, we will see more and more Fidelity FX titles on PC. A new golden age for Radeon for sure.
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 03:18 PM   #3
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ATI Technologies

OK Bill you called me out on AMD drivers at launch and in general. Here are a few of the known issues with the latest (6800) driver.

1. Metro Exodus™, Shadow of the Tomb Raider™, Battlefield™ V, Call of Duty®: Modern Warfare and Call of Duty®: Black Ops Cold War may experience intermittent application crashes with DirectX® Raytracing enabled.

Oops that a big bug for 6800 cards. So RT basically not usable yet in the only games that support 6800. Ergo it's broke and doesn't work properly now there's a shock

2 Anisotropic Filtering in Radeon Software graphics settings is not taking effect in DirexctX®9 applications on RDNA graphics products.

Someone mentioned this in a previous post and it's still not fixed. Not a big one but maybe worth mentioning that they've not bothered fixing it.
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 03:25 PM   #4
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ATI Technologies

OK Higgy about two people managed to buy one on launch day. I think this should still be the unofficial page as it was a massive paper launch. I noticed you didn't call it the owners thread

I'll try and buy an AIB 6800XT next Wednesday but if not possible I'm giving up and will wait until next year and then see which is more available, the 6800XT or 3080. Toss of a coin really. Lost faith in AMD after yesterday TBH. They fed us total BS IMHO. Just my 2c's.
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 03:32 PM   #5
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ATI Technologies

Oh dear here's Gibbo from Overclockers UK's take on next Wednesday's AIB launch.

"Limited to nearly no stock. We will launch at 2pm but won't allow ordering and then later in the day we shall make ordering possible once the web traffic drops down, hopefully this plan will help prevent such crazy overselling."

A bit of a joke really from AMD. No better than Nvidia even though scum bag Azor had the temerity to say the 6800 wouldn't be a paper launch. Ha. Sack him now.
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 03:29 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by LordHawkwind View Post
OK Bill you called me out on AMD drivers at launch and in general. Here are a few of the known issues with the latest (6800) driver.

1. Metro Exodus™, Shadow of the Tomb Raider™, Battlefield™ V, Call of Duty®: Modern Warfare and Call of Duty®: Black Ops Cold War may experience intermittent application crashes with DirectX® Raytracing enabled.

Oops that a big bug for 6800 cards. So RT basically not usable yet in the only games that support 6800. Ergo it's broke and doesn't work properly now there's a shock

2 Anisotropic Filtering in Radeon Software graphics settings is not taking effect in DirexctX®9 applications on RDNA graphics products.

Someone mentioned this in a previous post and it's still not fixed. Not a big one but maybe worth mentioning that they've not bothered fixing it.
This is 100% trolling. That's not what the release notes say - "may" and "intermittent" is different than "not usable" and "broken". Also not being able to force AF on DX9 games from the app doesn't mean that, if you enable AF from within game it won't work. So please stop trying to initiate a flame war around here.
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 04:05 PM   #7
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So you're the new tone of AMD are you? Trying to abuse your customers because you think we're too stupid to understand? An apology would be gratefully accepted.
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 04:33 PM   #8
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AMD RX 6800 XT GPU breaks world record while overclocked to 2.65GHz – and without any fancy cooling
Quote:
AMD’s Radeon RX 6800 XT has only just been released, but it has already taken one world record in a benchmark – albeit with a caveat – and proved that those rumors about Big Navi having great overclocking potential are true.

Videocardz spotted ‘Lucky_n00b’ (Indonesian overclocker Alva Jonathan) pushing the RX 6800 XT with a boost overclock to 2.65GHz on air – in other words, just using the graphics card’s stock fans, with no fancy cooling, which is seriously impressive in itself. Although the CPU it was paired with (AMD’s Ryzen 5950X) for the 3DMark Fire Strike record on HWBOT was liquid nitrogen-cooled (and ramped up to 5.4GHz).

The resulting tally of 47,932 took top spot on HWBOT, dethroning the reigning champion GPU which was Nvidia’s mighty RTX 3090. However, note that tessellation was disabled for the Big Navi card, which isn’t allowed when it comes to 3DMark’s Hall of Fame, hence this score didn’t count for that ranking.


https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-r...-fancy-cooling
2.65GHz

i want to see it watered cooled badly
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 03:39 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by LordHawkwind View Post
OK Bill you called me out on AMD drivers at launch and in general. Here are a few of the known issues with the latest (6800) driver.

1. Metro Exodus™, Shadow of the Tomb Raider™, Battlefield™ V, Call of Duty®: Modern Warfare and Call of Duty®: Black Ops Cold War may experience intermittent application crashes with DirectX® Raytracing enabled.

Oops that a big bug for 6800 cards. So RT basically not usable yet in the only games that support 6800. Ergo it's broke and doesn't work properly now there's a shock

2 Anisotropic Filtering in Radeon Software graphics settings is not taking effect in DirexctX®9 applications on RDNA graphics products.

Someone mentioned this in a previous post and it's still not fixed. Not a big one but maybe worth mentioning that they've not bothered fixing it.
we have a section for drivers
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Old Nov 19, 2020, 11:04 PM   #10
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I'll be trying to get a 6800xt or 6900xt. Using the 3080 till I can get a card worked it out with the buddy who is buying it.

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Old Nov 19, 2020, 11:53 PM   #11
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So, after watching some more reviews:

It looks to me like for 4K you want RTX 3000 series. For 1440P and below the 6800 series looks good. At least if we're talking about rasterization. I have to wonder whether it's the limited memory bandwidth that's holding the cards back in 4K?

Ray tracing performance is passable, but a little disappointing. The lack of a DLSS equivalent really hurts, since ray tracing is basically unplayable in some games without it. I don't fully cut AMD slack on this based on it being their "first gen of ray tracing", because Nvidia didn't really see much improvement in ray tracing with Ampere, outside it simply scaling with the cards being faster. I think it's still basically 1st gen vs 1st gen and AMD's implementation is not as good. It could be newer drivers and tweaks by game developers can improve it, but the jury is still out on that one.

The efficiency is nice compared to Ampere, however not all places saw the large difference that TechPowerUp did. I guess it depends on the game? Regardless, greater efficiency is still a plus.

Overall I think the cards are priced correctly, and are a decent product, not an amazing product. (However by that same measure, Ampere is also only a decent product.)

It's still impressive that AMD is back in the game and actually is more efficient for a change. This is their most competitive card released in a long time, I'd say going back all the way to 290X released 7 years ago. Hopefully this is the start of consistent improvement on the part of AMD, which means competition will heat up again in the GPU market.

In the end how well the cards do will come down to availability. If the AIBs show up in force next week then AMD will get a lot of sales. If the GPU shortage continues then the real determination will come down to how many cards AMD and Nvidia can deliver, with both selling everything they make.
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 02:00 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Nagorak View Post
So, after watching some more reviews:

It looks to me like for 4K you want RTX 3000 series. For 1440P and below the 6800 series looks good. At least if we're talking about rasterization. I have to wonder whether it's the limited memory bandwidth that's holding the cards back in 4K?

Ray tracing performance is passable, but a little disappointing. The lack of a DLSS equivalent really hurts, since ray tracing is basically unplayable in some games without it. I don't fully cut AMD slack on this based on it being their "first gen of ray tracing", because Nvidia didn't really see much improvement in ray tracing with Ampere, outside it simply scaling with the cards being faster. I think it's still basically 1st gen vs 1st gen and AMD's implementation is not as good. It could be newer drivers and tweaks by game developers can improve it, but the jury is still out on that one.

The efficiency is nice compared to Ampere, however not all places saw the large difference that TechPowerUp did. I guess it depends on the game? Regardless, greater efficiency is still a plus.

Overall I think the cards are priced correctly, and are a decent product, not an amazing product. (However by that same measure, Ampere is also only a decent product.)

It's still impressive that AMD is back in the game and actually is more efficient for a change. This is their most competitive card released in a long time, I'd say going back all the way to 290X released 7 years ago. Hopefully this is the start of consistent improvement on the part of AMD, which means competition will heat up again in the GPU market.

In the end how well the cards do will come down to availability. If the AIBs show up in force next week then AMD will get a lot of sales. If the GPU shortage continues then the real determination will come down to how many cards AMD and Nvidia can deliver, with both selling everything they make.
I don't think you are necessarily being fair in your view on Ray tracing. Nvidia has been working on their generation 1 for 2 years, and when their ray tracing was first introduced 2 years ago, it's performance was much, much worse than it is today, as well of also running into bugs. So I don't think you can call it first gen against first gen unless you go back and compare day 1 AMD to day 1 Nvidia. Nvidia required multiple patches in BF5 to deal with some of the issues, along with performance enhancements optimizations, which wasn't full illumination. They have also had 2 years to optimize it via drivers. The fact that the Ampere isn't really an improvement is really a huge black mark on Nvidia. Out of the gate, AMD is expected to do full illumination from the get go and shine? Yet, full illumination didn't' even happen for Nvidia until Metro Exodus. Not to mention that Nvidia had their hand in the cookie jar the whole time having all these games optimized for them. Sot heir should be a little more slack given to AMD than what it appears you are giving. Just my opinion.
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 02:25 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by NWR_Midnight View Post
I don't think you are necessarily being fair in your view on Ray tracing. Nvidia has been working on their generation 1 for 2 years, and when their ray tracing was first introduced 2 years ago, it's performance was much, much worse than it is today, as well of also running into bugs. So I don't think you can call it first gen against first gen unless you go back and compare day 1 AMD to day 1 Nvidia. Nvidia required multiple patches in BF5 to deal with some of the issues, along with performance enhancements optimizations, which wasn't full illumination. They have also had 2 years to optimize it via drivers. The fact that the Ampere isn't really an improvement is really a huge black mark on Nvidia. Out of the gate, AMD is expected to do full illumination from the get go and shine? Yet, full illumination didn't' even happen for Nvidia until Metro Exodus. Not to mention that Nvidia had their hand in the cookie jar the whole time having all these games optimized for them. Sot heir should be a little more slack given to AMD than what it appears you are giving. Just my opinion.


you can't it was close to two months after the 2080 ti came out before the first ray tracing game Battlefield V came out and you could do more than a short demo with a 1200 buck RT card

and then it was months between new RT games for NV to tweak them
then with some games RT and or DLSS was added 6 months after the game came out

and lets get real

Quote:
Ray tracing games you can play right now:


Amid Evil
Battlefield V
Bright Memory
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare (2019)
Control
Crysis Remastered
Deliver Us The Moon
Fortnite
Ghostrunner
Justice
Mechwarrior V: Mercenaries
Metro Exodus
Minecraft
Moonlight Blade
Pumpkin Jack
Quake II RTX
Shadow of the Tomb Raider
Stay in the Light
Watch Dogs Legion
Wolfenstein: Youngblood
https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/202...ss-games-2020/

and some of them just plain suck .
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 02:43 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by bill dennison View Post


you can't it was close to two months after the 2080 ti came out before the first ray tracing game Battlefield V came out and you could do more than a short demo with a 1200 buck RT card

and then it was months between new RT games for NV to tweak them
then with some games RT and or DLSS was added 6 months after the game came out

and lets get real



https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/202...ss-games-2020/

and some of them just plain suck .

And another matter is ....
When only a 700-800 $ GPU + fancy CPU can play RT at more than 60 fps at 1080p or 1440p and usually this guys have 4k stuff... What do you do with native resolution if one wants to play RT smooth ? Change the monitor ? Downscaling from native resolution is looking bad from what i know ?
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 02:55 AM   #15
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And another matter is ....
When only a 700-800 $ GPU + fancy CPU can play RT at more than 60 fps at 1080p or 1440p and usually this guys have 4k stuff... What do you do with native resolution if one wants to play RT smooth ? Change the monitor ? Downscaling from native resolution is looking bad from what i know ?
You wait for the 3085. Then you wait for the 4080, then the 4085 and so on.
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 10:52 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by bill dennison View Post


you can't it was close to two months after the 2080 ti came out before the first ray tracing game Battlefield V came out and you could do more than a short demo with a 1200 buck RT card

and then it was months between new RT games for NV to tweak them
then with some games RT and or DLSS was added 6 months after the game came out

and lets get real



https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/202...ss-games-2020/

and some of them just plain suck .
Exactly. Someone gets it!
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Originally Posted by Shapeshifter View Post
Thank you! Had to scroll thru 2/3 of a page of posts about availability talk that belongs in the designated topic for it, to get to something that has to do with performance and the actual card itself.
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 07:39 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by NWR_Midnight View Post
I don't think you are necessarily being fair in your view on Ray tracing. Nvidia has been working on their generation 1 for 2 years, and when their ray tracing was first introduced 2 years ago, it's performance was much, much worse than it is today, as well of also running into bugs. So I don't think you can call it first gen against first gen unless you go back and compare day 1 AMD to day 1 Nvidia. Nvidia required multiple patches in BF5 to deal with some of the issues, along with performance enhancements optimizations, which wasn't full illumination. They have also had 2 years to optimize it via drivers. The fact that the Ampere isn't really an improvement is really a huge black mark on Nvidia. Out of the gate, AMD is expected to do full illumination from the get go and shine? Yet, full illumination didn't' even happen for Nvidia until Metro Exodus. Not to mention that Nvidia had their hand in the cookie jar the whole time having all these games optimized for them. Sot heir should be a little more slack given to AMD than what it appears you are giving. Just my opinion.
No, this is a fair counterpoint. I was thinking mostly in hardware terms, not software optimization, which Nvidia has had a lot more time to do (both on the driver and developer level).

I still have mixed feelings about the importance of ray tracing this gen, because the performance hit is usually quite high for any substantial effects, and even now not that many games support it.
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 11:01 PM   #18
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Well I do wonder about the flexibility of AMD ray tracing.

It does not have a fixed portion of the chip dedicated to RT so in theory they could adjust RT performance at the cost of raster performance, would be nice if a user could dial in the % of compute used for RT.

I expect the 6900xt with a few more spare CU's might have a bit more of bump in RT than people expect.

What if they went all out RT and basic raster eg quake II RT
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Old Nov 20, 2020, 11:14 PM   #19
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Well I do wonder about the flexibility of AMD ray tracing.

It does not have a fixed portion of the chip dedicated to RT so in theory they could adjust RT performance at the cost of raster performance, would be nice if a user could dial in the % of compute used for RT.

I expect the 6900xt with a few more spare CU's might have a bit more of bump in RT than people expect.

What if they went all out RT and basic raster eg quake II RT
no it does


Quote:
Each compute unit packs a total of 64 stream processors, 16 texture mapping units, four texture filter units, and a single Ray Accelerator unit that handles the raytracing capabilities of the GPU

https://wccftech.com/review/amd-rade...es-big-navi/2/

6800 xt
so 72 Compute Units = 72 RT Cores

or 6900 xt
80 Compute Units = 80 RT Cores
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Old Nov 21, 2020, 03:01 AM   #20
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I could be wrong but each CU can be used for RT OR other operations not both at the same time.
That was what the rumors were. Turned out to be false. At least from current available info.

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Old Nov 21, 2020, 10:10 AM   #21
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More picts at videocardz. Weve already seen the large powercolor but kinda find the XFX is small this time?
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Old Nov 21, 2020, 11:58 AM   #22
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AMD's Infinity Cache is the MVP of the RX 6000-series, and it's only going to get better
Quote:
But what if a developer did program specifically for Infinity Cache? That's a question raised during an AMD roundtable discussion ahead of the RX 6800 XT and RX 6800 release date, and AMD is quietly optimistic for future performance if a developer were to team up with the red team for a little more juice.

"You know, there is the potential for benefits from providing more direct controls," Pomianowski continues, "we have … quite an extensive set of ways in which the Infinity Cache can be controlled.

"That's something we will we will look at. I mean in our initial interactions with developers we talked to them about ways that, if they understand that the cache is there, that they can perhaps alter how they do their rendering to be more friendly to the cache—get even more benefits out of it, you know, the ways in which you order rendering and place things can realise definite gains."


Perhaps there's even more leverage for a developer to do so with the Xbox Series X, Series S, and PlayStation 5 all utilising the Infinity Cache through the use of RDNA 2 silicon. There's a lot of modern red team silicon around right now, and that's potentially a feather in the hat of AMD as it works to lessen Nvidia's choke-hold on the graphics card market.
https://www.pcgamer.com/amd-infinity...x-6800-rdna-2/

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Old Nov 21, 2020, 12:08 PM   #23
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They look super cool. At this point though, I'd take anything I could get.
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Old Nov 21, 2020, 12:15 PM   #24
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In looking for the bottleneck as to why the 3 gpus dont scale to their CU count Im wondering if having the same amount of IF is the issue. Im sure navi3 will have likely double this amount as it obviously works right out of the box fps wise.
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Old Nov 21, 2020, 12:31 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pax View Post
In looking for the bottleneck as to why the 3 gpus dont scale to their CU count Im wondering if having the same amount of IF is the issue. Im sure navi3 will have likely double this amount as it obviously works right out of the box fps wise.

that maybe or they may just tune driver more for 4k


but this one has a Patent
Quote:
The patent alleges its cache optimization boosts performance 22% - 52% and doubles performance in deep learning applications. These two claims would seem to be how AMD is improving RDNA2's deep-learning substitute for DLSS.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comment...paper_details/
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