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Other Graphics Cards and 3D Technologies Discussion forum for any graphics hardware not provided by AMD/ATI. Also place to discuss 3D technologies such as 3D Stereo, PhysX and other interesting developments/rumours in the 3D industry.

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Old Sep 22, 2022, 03:41 PM   #1381
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bill dennison
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8-pin PCIe to ATX 12VHPWR Adapter Included with RTX 40-series Graphics Cards Has a Limited Service-Life of 30 Connect-Disconnect Cycles
https://www.techpowerup.com/299162/8...connect-cycles
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 03:43 PM   #1382
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Originally Posted by koralis View Post
I have a feeling that's the real target of DLSS 3... content creators. Imagine having to render only 1/3 of the frames for Game of Thrones and let the AI do an ok job at the other two that are in between time-intensive raytraced frames. HUGE productivity boost and cost savings. If it's every other frame, or you render 3/4s of the frames and let the AI fill in the 4th, it's still big.

If it happens to help gamers, bonus.
Optical flow already exists for use in things Adobe premiere, Da Vinci resolve etc. You can even look at YT videos going back like 6 years. It's not new for video. Often used to do things like fake slow-mo and to a lesser extent try and fix a frame rate mis-match.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 05:41 PM   #1383
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Mega, you follow?
No.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 06:08 PM   #1384
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No.
Seriously, no P&R type talk here, two of your posts were already removed by an Admin.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 06:08 PM   #1385
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Originally Posted by Shapeshifter View Post
Nvidia is trying *really* hard to make up the loss of mining sales. Jacking prices on cards $400.00 and $500.00 over historical norms is a little much.

I could understand $100.00 like with the 4090 but selling a 4070 as a 4080 and then adding $400.00 is a bridge too far.

I do hope that AMD rains on their parade and we get a good card or two out of them.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 06:28 PM   #1386
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Originally Posted by andino View Post
I could understand $100.00 like with the 4090 but selling a 4070 as a 4080 and then adding $400.00 is a bridge too far.

I do hope that AMD rains on their parade and we get a good card or two out of them.
Seconded.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 06:30 PM   #1387
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Originally Posted by Gandalfthewhite View Post
if im AMD

7900xt 1299 trades blows with 4090
7800xt 899 trades blows with 4080 16gig
7800 649 trades blows with 4080 12gig

obviously AMD will lose once DLSS3.0 is factored in even in cases wheere FSR2.0 and dlss are both implemented. Will likely be comparable (within 10%) of current RT but fall behind of new "enhanced RT" that NV will be pushing now.

If AMD can do that they can get much needed mindshare and some marketshare.
2 things one FSR 3.0 is likely to be part of the new gpu gen and that could play catch up a bit vs 2.0. Probably not as much fps boost as DLSS 3.0 but AMD may play the PQ card there vs the fps one.

RT has been widely said to be 2-3x current 6900xt so way more than 10% current gen. Or did you mean 10% of RTX 4k? Then ya.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 06:31 PM   #1388
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Originally Posted by andino View Post
Nvidia is trying *really* hard to make up the loss of mining sales. Jacking prices on cards $400.00 and $500.00 over historical norms is a little much.

I could understand $100.00 like with the 4090 but selling a 4070 as a 4080 and then adding $400.00 is a bridge too far.

I do hope that AMD rains on their parade and we get a good card or two out of them.
Bring The Rain ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTQeog8fInw
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 06:39 PM   #1389
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Originally Posted by bill dennison View Post
Bring The Rain ?

Had a neighbor of mine that flew those planes and those kind of missions a few years back. They were never that close to the action though. Dude was crazy.

He did say that it was hard as hell to hold the plane straight when they were firing rounds. The air force had an auto pilot mode for the plane so that it could stay on target for the run but the recoil always kicked the auto pilot off. lol
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 07:32 PM   #1390
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Originally Posted by pax View Post
2 things one FSR 3.0 is likely to be part of the new gpu gen and that could play catch up a bit vs 2.0. Probably not as much fps boost as DLSS 3.0 but AMD may play the PQ card there vs the fps one.

RT has been widely said to be 2-3x current 6900xt so way more than 10% current gen. Or did you mean 10% of RTX 4k? Then ya.
I meant 4xxx on current gen games. We know NV is going to be pushing hard on the new enhanced RT now because it is where they added a lot of hardware.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 07:58 PM   #1391
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Originally Posted by bill dennison View Post
Wccftech has that story too, and they posted an update. NVIDIA claims that the older PCIe 8-pin connector has the same service life.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 08:43 PM   #1392
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Originally Posted by Android1 View Post
Wccftech has that story too, and they posted an update. NVIDIA claims that the older PCIe 8-pin connector has the same service life.
well nope

i've most like unpluged and repluged the PCIe 8-pin connectors my older 1200 watt PSU over 200 time each
sometimes i have done it 10 to 15 times just rewireing to look better
i got it before my 1800x threadripper

still fine no problem

i should replace that PSU it's like 8+ years old
it very well may go back to my hd 7970 CFX Intel MB
had a lot of cards and rebuilds since then


...........

what about the soldered on plug on the card can you only plug it in 25 times also
is that covered by warranty
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 08:44 PM   #1393
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Originally Posted by Gandalfthewhite View Post
I meant 4xxx on current gen games. We know NV is going to be pushing hard on the new enhanced RT now because it is where they added a lot of hardware.
If NV RT is more ecosystem to NV only it could get more perf when optimized but I think HW wise AMD can be closer to NV overall than 6k to 3k gen. Maybe 10-20% behind at most. If its about DLSS3's perf boost it could put a wrench in RT things for AMD. But if games dont optimize or dont support DLSS 3 we could see AMD beat NV in some RT games.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 10:24 PM   #1394
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Originally Posted by bill dennison View Post
well nope

i've most like unpluged and repluged the PCIe 8-pin connectors my older 1200 watt PSU over 200 time each
sometimes i have done it 10 to 15 times just rewireing to look better
i got it before my 1800x threadripper

still fine no problem

i should replace that PSU it's like 8+ years old
it very well may go back to my hd 7970 CFX Intel MB
had a lot of cards and rebuilds since then


...........

what about the soldered on plug on the card can you only plug it in 25 times also
is that covered by warranty
It could be that the official service life is just extremely conservative. At least I hope that is the case, and NVIDIA isn’t lying.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 10:32 PM   #1395
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Inventory is not likely to be an issue with the 40 series. The local zotac distributor is assuring day 1 availability for all pre-orders. We usually have to wait at-least a month before the trickle starts. The price, though, is closer to $1800.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 10:42 PM   #1396
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Originally Posted by alitayyab View Post
Inventory is not likely to be an issue with the 40 series. The local zotac distributor is assuring day 1 availability for all pre-orders. We usually have to wait at-least a month before the trickle starts. The price, though, is closer to $1800.
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Old Sep 22, 2022, 11:39 PM   #1397
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So that HPWR connector is basically the new internal 3.0 header then?

https://www.gamersnexus.net/news-pc/...ing-gpu-cables

Last edited by Mangler : Sep 22, 2022 at 11:47 PM.
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 12:12 AM   #1398
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More info provided by Nvidia.

https://wccftech.com/geforce-rtx-409...led-by-nvidia/

It looks like cyberpunk runs nearly 3X the speed of the 3090 in it's current state and 1.9X the speed I'm getting now with the new ultra RT patch that's coming down the line. So nearly 4x the speed of the 3090 with the new RT patch. I thought 2x the performance would be possible thanks to the new RT cores but I didn't see DLSS 3.0 pushing things so far ahead. It's really shocking to me that they have managed 140+ FPS where I am getting 50FPS now with a 3090.

It's nice to see FPS numbers on this one. I'm not sure where I stand on the current value of things these days. Back when the 2000 series hit, I knew that next to nothing would support RTX and I looked at DLSS as unproven tech. Once I got the 3090 I realized the potential of DLSS and noticed that RT cores were now strong enough to make even more of a difference than raw raster performance in titles like Dying Light 2.

I know NV tried to sell the 2000 series with lower raster performance because they obviously saw the added benefits of RT and Tensor cores but at that time it wasn't supported very well yet and the titles that did were a bit too demanding. Things changed as expected with the next gen when more games came out and the added power of the new gen RT cores made a splash.

It's not until a couple of months ago that I came to the realization that RT and Tensor performance might be able to boost FPS more than raw cuda core power if the games support RT and DLSS. Now we have most new games supporting it and a list of old games that do as well.

I think Nvidia is going to try and sell RT and DLSS as equals to raw raster performance and maybe that is ok now? I'm not really sure. Most of my games that don't support RT or DLSS run pretty well already. RDR2 was the only game I had that still ran on the edge but they eventually added DLSS to that as well. I'm not sure but if DLSS 3.0 and the new RT cores boost FPS by nearly 2x on old games and even more on the new ones coming down the line then maybe it's justifiable to have a smaller raster boost these days. Obviously that will be up to the individual but I could see some lower end 4000 series cards being slower than 3000 series high end but still outperforming them on most major titles that came out in the last few years and the next two years to come. Just a thought.

Last edited by the_sextein : Sep 23, 2022 at 12:20 AM.
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 12:34 AM   #1399
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Originally Posted by the_sextein View Post
More info provided by Nvidia.

https://wccftech.com/geforce-rtx-409...led-by-nvidia/

It looks like cyberpunk runs nearly 3X the speed of the 3090 in it's current state and 1.9X the speed I'm getting now with the new ultra RT patch that's coming down the line. So nearly 4x the speed of the 3090 with the new RT patch. I thought 2x the performance would be possible thanks to the new RT cores but I didn't see DLSS 3.0 pushing things so far ahead. It's really shocking to me that they have managed 140+ FPS where I am getting 50FPS now with a 3090.

It's nice to see FPS numbers on this one. I'm not sure where I stand on the current value of things these days. Back when the 2000 series hit, I knew that next to nothing would support RTX and I looked at DLSS as unproven tech. Once I got the 3090 I realized the potential of DLSS and noticed that RT cores were now strong enough to make even more of a difference than raw raster performance in titles like Dying Light 2.

I know NV tried to sell the 2000 series with lower raster performance because they obviously saw the added benefits of RT and Tensor cores but at that time it wasn't supported very well yet and the titles that did were a bit too demanding. Things changed as expected with the next gen when more games came out and the added power of the new gen RT cores made a splash.

It's not until a couple of months ago that I came to the realization that RT and Tensor performance might be able to boost FPS more than raw cuda core power if the games support RT and DLSS. Now we have most new games supporting it and a list of old games that do as well.

I think Nvidia is going to try and sell RT and DLSS as equals to raw raster performance and maybe that is ok now? I'm not really sure. Most of my games that don't support RT or DLSS run pretty well already. RDR2 was the only game I had that still ran on the edge but they eventually added DLSS to that as well. I'm not sure but if DLSS 3.0 and the new RT cores boost FPS by nearly 2x on old games and even more on the new ones coming down the line then maybe it's justifiable to have a smaller raster boost these days. Obviously that will be up to the individual but I could see some lower end 4000 series cards being slower than 3000 series high end but still outperforming them on most major titles that came out in the last few years and the next two years to come. Just a thought.
so Cyberpunk 2077 (RT) - 141 FPS /2 - 70.5 real FPS

70.5 real FPS
+
70.5 fake FPS with the new DLSS 3.0

going to need to see DLSS off benchmarks
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 12:50 AM   #1400
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Its such an uplift its a bit suspicious as best case scenario on a handful of games and or bottom of the barrel performance mode in DLSS with likely PQ issues.

Will be interesting to see reviews.
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 03:39 AM   #1401
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It looks odd to me. My 3090 gets about 25FPS without DLSS so I don't know how the 4090 would be performing that well. If the 4090 has 50% more performance because of raster and another 50% because of the improved RT cores then that would be about 50FPS. DLSS 3.0 would have to improve FPS by 2.5X-3X by itself in order to reach that speed. Seems kinda crazy to me but that is what the chart is showing. If it's true then that would be really cool but I'm kinda skeptical at this point. I guess DLSS 2.0 improved my FPS from 25 to 50 though so DLSS 3.0 probably could do that. Heck I don't know. Crazy speeds. Thats what I'm talking about with RTX and DLSS, it's like their effects snowball so if RT cores and raster combine to double the FPS and DLSS more than doubles it again you get insane levels of performance without pushing the cuda core increase beyond the normal. You could get impressive results even with much weaker cards. One of the demo videos on youtube shows it running 60FPS native at 1440P without DLSS so the raw performance is probably between where me and bill were guessing. It's a way larger jump in performance than anything I've ever seen.

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Old Sep 23, 2022, 05:19 AM   #1402
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Originally Posted by the_sextein View Post
It looks odd to me. My 3090 gets about 25FPS without DLSS so I don't know how the 4090 would be performing that well. If the 4090 has 50% more performance because of raster and another 50% because of the improved RT cores then that would be about 50FPS. DLSS 3.0 would have to improve FPS by 2.5X-3X by itself in order to reach that speed. Seems kinda crazy to me but that is what the chart is showing. If it's true then that would be really cool but I'm kinda skeptical at this point. I guess DLSS 2.0 improved my FPS from 25 to 50 though so DLSS 3.0 probably could do that. Heck I don't know. Crazy speeds. Thats what I'm talking about with RTX and DLSS, it's like their effects snowball so if RT cores and raster combine to double the FPS and DLSS more than doubles it again you get insane levels of performance without pushing the cuda core increase beyond the normal. You could get impressive results even with much weaker cards. One of the demo videos on youtube shows it running 60FPS native at 1440P without DLSS so the raw performance is probably between where me and bill were guessing. It's a way larger jump in performance than anything I've ever seen.
It's not crazy when you realize DLSS 3 is using DLSS Frame generation. It's inserting what are essentially interpolated frames to get the boost.
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 07:46 AM   #1403
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Sounds like witchcraft to me. Burn the jacket?

I can hear the AMD fankids screaming cheating already.
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 08:04 AM   #1404
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We don't know enough about DLSS3.0 yet to make inferences on how it's going to run. Whole lot of assumptions on this frame generation stuff.

Waiting to see what it will really be..
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 08:04 AM   #1405
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Sounds like witchcraft to me. Burn the jacket?

I can hear the AMD fankids screaming cheating already.
Let's see if AMD comes out with same thing in FSR 3.0
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 10:57 AM   #1406
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nVidia NVIDIA RTX 4090 Boosts Up to 2.8 GHz at Stock Playing Cyberpunk 2077

At a temperature of about 50 to 55 °C.

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4090 is turning out to be a cool operator, with the GPU reportedly boosting up to 2.8 GHz (2810 to 2850 MHz) at stock settings, when playing Cyberpunk 2077 at 1440p, in its "psycho" settings preset. with DLSS and Reflex disabled. At native resolution, the RTX 4090 scores 59 FPS (49 FPS at 1% lows), with a frame-time of 72 to 75 ms. With 100% GPU utilization, the card barely breaks a sweat, with GPU temperatures reported in the region of 50 to 55 °C. With DLSS 3 enabled, the game nearly doubles in frame-rate, to 119 FPS (1% lows), and an average latency of 53 ms. This is a net 2X gain in frame-rate with latency reduced by a third. The power-draw is also said to be significantly reduced. The card pulls up to 461 W when rendering at native-resolution, but this drops down to 348 W with DLSS 3 "quality," a 25% reduction.


Sources: techPowerUp, Wccftech
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 11:06 AM   #1407
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nVidia NVIDIA AD103 and AD104 Chips Powering RTX 4080 Series Detailed

AD102’s little brothers.

Here's our first look at the "AD103" and "AD104" chips powering the GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB and RTX 4080 12 GB, respectively, thanks to Ryan Smith from Anandtech. These are the second- and third-largest implementations of the GeForce "Ada" graphics architecture, with the "AD102" powering the RTX 4090 being the largest. Both chips are built on the same TSMC 4N (4 nm EUV) silicon fabrication process as the AD102, but are significantly distant from it in specifications. For example, the AD102 has a staggering 80 percent more number-crunching machinery than the AD103, and a 50 percent wider memory interface. The sheer numbers at play here, enable NVIDIA to carve out dozens of SKUs based on the three chips alone, before we're shown the mid-range "AD106" in the future.

The AD103 die measures 378.6 mm², significantly smaller than the 608 mm² of the AD102, and it reflects in a much lower transistor count of 45.9 billion. The chip physically features 80 streaming multiprocessors (SM), which work out to 10,240 CUDA cores, 320 Tensor cores, 80 RT cores, and 320 TMUs. The chip is endowed with a healthy ROP count of 112, and has a 256-bit wide GDDR6X memory interface. The AD104 is smaller still, with a die-size of 294.5 mm², a transistor count of 35.8 billion, 60 SM, 7,680 CUDA cores, 240 Tensor cores, 60 RT cores, 240 TMUs, and 80 ROPs. Ryan Smith says that the RTX 4080 12 GB maxes out the AD104, which means its memory interface is physically just 192-bit wide.


Sources: techPowerUp!, Ryan Smith (Twitter), VideoCardz.com
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 12:24 PM   #1408
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The 4090 is only running the game at 59fps at 1440P?
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 12:26 PM   #1409
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It says "Psycho" preset, but that doesn't make sense for 59 FPS.
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Old Sep 23, 2022, 12:59 PM   #1410
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It says "Psycho" preset, but that doesn't make sense for 59 FPS.
In the city with lots of NPCs and no DLSS? I believe it.
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