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    Official AMD Radeon RX 7000 Series (RDNA 3) Thread



    My thoughts:
    1. 3 6nm or 5nm compute dies
    2. 1 7nm I/O die
    3. 384mb/256mb/128 Infinity Cache pools
    4. 384bit or 256 bit memory bus
    5. Chiplets and memory will be using AMD's infinity fabric technology
    6. I/O die could also have the video processing hardware, ROP's and Ray accelerators
    7. Compute dies will be mostly shaders



    This chiplet setup is primed and ready for a FPGA take over in due time from an outsiders perspective looking in. Not just for RDNA but Zen as well. The Xilinks purchase is looking pretty genius.

    Theoretically you could see the 7800, 7700 and 7600 all come out at the same time since they will be using the same compute chip. Smaller less complex chips that are can be scaled by mere count rather than complexity or turning off sections of the chip will have dramatic impacts on yields, time to market, power, and price.
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    #2
    this will be AMD going back to HBM as well. calling it now. Prices for HBM have dropped SIGNIFICANTLY in the last 2 years.
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    Comment


      #3
      AMD is expecting the next-gen RDNA 3 GPUs scheduled for 2021 to deliver 50% improved performance-per-watt over the new RX 6000 series
      https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-is....503412.0.html


      AMD promises RDNA 3 GPUs will be as big a leap forward as Big Navi
      https://technosports.co.in/2020/08/1...like-zen-cpus/


      [yt]E39nOb6D4_4[/yt]

      Comment


        #4
        One thing NAAF didnt mention is that one of the more consistent rumors about navi3 is that the geometry engine is overhauled and much stronger than navi2. They want to do away with what has been apparently been a bit of a weak spot on amd gpus.

        So not just an obviously bigger IF cache and more shaders and RT units but some significant architectural changes. I hope they match nvidia nvenc.
        I talked to the tree. Thats why they put me away!..." Peter Sellers, The Goon Show
        Only superficial people cant be superficial... Oscar Wilde

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        Ignore List: Keystone, Andino... -My Baron, he wishes to inform you that vendetta, as he puts it in the ancient tongue, the art of kanlee is still alive... He does not wish to meet or speak with you...-
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        "The Intelligibility of the Universe itself needs explanation. It is not the gaps of understanding of the world that points to God but rather the very comprehensibility of scientific and other forms of understanding that requires an explanation." -Richard Swinburne

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        Comment


          #5
          I hope they don't gimp the memory bandwidth so I can actually consider buying one. Come on baby, give us the goods.

          If this progresses as rapidly as Ryzen did, then either RDNA3 or 4 will be the GPUs to buy. The only thing different, is that I don't see NV laying over and being lazy. The rumor of them moving back to TSMC means I expect a massive leap over Ampere..
          Originally posted by curio
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          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by SuperGeil View Post
            This chiplet setup is primed and ready for a FPGA take over in due time from an outsiders perspective looking in. Not just for RDNA but Zen as well. The Xilinks purchase is looking pretty genius.
            What does this mean?

            Typically you can't replace perf/w and outright performance sensitive ASICs with FPGAs.

            There are no FPGAs running 5GHz CPU cores, or 3GHZ GPU cores.

            This is why I don't comprehend the 'FPGA take over' comment.

            What does FPGA take over mean, and why does a chiplet strategy prime it?

            IMO the Xilinx acquisition is only for more datacenter and networking market share opportunities.

            Comment


              #7
              Happy new year Jim! Hope you and fam are doing well.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by caveman-jim View Post
                What does this mean?

                Typically you can't replace perf/w and outright performance sensitive ASICs with FPGAs.

                There are no FPGAs running 5GHz CPU cores, or 3GHZ GPU cores.

                This is why I don't comprehend the 'FPGA take over' comment.

                What does FPGA take over mean, and why does a chiplet strategy prime it?

                IMO the Xilinx acquisition is only for more datacenter and networking market share opportunities.

                Yea the Xilinx thing was for IP Id read and the upcoming 3d chip stacking which xilinx has some knowhow for.
                I talked to the tree. Thats why they put me away!..." Peter Sellers, The Goon Show
                Only superficial people cant be superficial... Oscar Wilde

                Piledriver Rig 2016: Gigabyte G1 gaming 990fx. FX 8350 cpu. XFX RX 480 GTR Cats 22.7.1, SoundBlaster ZXR, 2 x 8 gig ddr3 1866 Kingston. 1 x 2tb Firecuda seagate with 8 gig mlc SSHD. Sharp 60" 4k 60 hz tv. Win 10 home.

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                Ignore List: Keystone, Andino... -My Baron, he wishes to inform you that vendetta, as he puts it in the ancient tongue, the art of kanlee is still alive... He does not wish to meet or speak with you...-
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                "The Intelligibility of the Universe itself needs explanation. It is not the gaps of understanding of the world that points to God but rather the very comprehensibility of scientific and other forms of understanding that requires an explanation." -Richard Swinburne

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                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by acroig View Post
                  Happy new year Jim! Hope you and fam are doing well.


                  Nice to know he still reads the forum and can still slam the hammer down on nonsense when it appears.
                  Intel 10600K @4.9GHz, Nvidia RTX 3070(ZOTAC Twin Edge),MSI MPG 490 Gaming Edge, Corsair Vengeance 16GB 3200MHZ,LG 27GL850-B.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by caveman-jim View Post
                    What does this mean?

                    Typically you can't replace perf/w and outright performance sensitive ASICs with FPGAs.

                    There are no FPGAs running 5GHz CPU cores, or 3GHZ GPU cores.

                    This is why I don't comprehend the 'FPGA take over' comment.

                    What does FPGA take over mean, and why does a chiplet strategy prime it?

                    IMO the Xilinx acquisition is only for more datacenter and networking market share opportunities.
                    This is what financial analyst's think of the deal.

                    - AMD is paying 74 times XLNX earnings, based on by far XLNX's highest earnings in the last five years.
                    - AMD are paying a 25% premium on the Xilinx current stock value.
                    - The FPGA market is not a big growth area anyway. Their CAGR is 5.9% over the last five years.
                    - XLNX's revenue looks lackluster.
                    - Neither company generates enough free cash flow to take on competitors Intel or Nvidia long term.
                    - AMD's rocket ship stock price has a CAGR of 95% over the last five years.

                    When Lisa Su announced it all she talked about was opportunities in datacentre, NICS and 5G. Nothing whatsoever to do with CPU's and GPU's. She did mention $300m synergies in the first year through cost duplication (getting rid of staff) which is nothing new.

                    Happy New Year Caveman nice to see you posting again.
                    Ryzen 7 3800X, ASUS Prime X470 Pro, KFA2 RTX 3090 SG, 16GB Crucial DDR4 LPX 3000 Ram, iiyama G-Master GB3466WQSU 3440x1440 freesync 144hz, 250gb Samsung SSD, 750mb Seagate SSHD, 2TB Seagate Barracuda H/D, 1 TB Samsung H/D, 850w PSU, Windows 10

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by NIGELG View Post


                      Nice to know he still reads the forum and can still slam the hammer down on nonsense when it appears.
                      , I miss him slamming the hammer.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by pax View Post
                        Yea the Xilinx thing was for IP Id read and the upcoming 3d chip stacking which xilinx has some knowhow for.
                        Originally posted by LordHawkwind View Post
                        This is what financial analyst's think of the deal.

                        - AMD is paying 74 times XLNX earnings, based on by far XLNX's highest earnings in the last five years.
                        - AMD are paying a 25% premium on the Xilinx current stock value.
                        - The FPGA market is not a big growth area anyway. Their CAGR is 5.9% over the last five years.
                        - XLNX's revenue looks lackluster.
                        - Neither company generates enough free cash flow to take on competitors Intel or Nvidia long term.
                        - AMD's rocket ship stock price has a CAGR of 95% over the last five years.

                        When Lisa Su announced it all she talked about was opportunities in datacentre, NICS and 5G. Nothing whatsoever to do with CPU's and GPU's. She did mention $300m synergies in the first year through cost duplication (getting rid of staff) which is nothing new.

                        Happy New Year Caveman nice to see you posting again.
                        I think Xilinx portfolio is strong by itself for the datacenter and enterprise networking (5G/RAN, Datacenter networking, DPU, etc.). They have strong market share and good IP. Xilinx products have a lot of synergies for market attach with AMD datacenter and enterprise platforms, plus future products bringing the IP roadmaps together.

                        FPGAs are in strong demand right now for lots of different applications using AI, as the models change 2x -3x faster than ASICs can be designed and produced. As the model evolution calms down domain-specific hardware (or workload-focused, at least) will be more prevalent, and will need to be more integrated than chips in sockets either side of a PCIe or similar bus; integration will have to happen both in-package, and in-SoC.

                        Originally posted by NIGELG View Post


                        Nice to know he still reads the forum and can still slam the hammer down on nonsense when it appears.
                        Originally posted by acroig View Post
                        , I miss him slamming the hammer.
                        Well I wasn't trying to club anyone, just asking cos I didn't get the connection between chiplets and FPGAs

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by LordHawkwind View Post
                          This is what financial analyst's think of the deal.

                          - AMD is paying 74 times XLNX earnings, based on by far XLNX's highest earnings in the last five years.
                          - AMD are paying a 25% premium on the Xilinx current stock value.
                          - The FPGA market is not a big growth area anyway. Their CAGR is 5.9% over the last five years.
                          - XLNX's revenue looks lackluster.
                          - Neither company generates enough free cash flow to take on competitors Intel or Nvidia long term.
                          - AMD's rocket ship stock price has a CAGR of 95% over the last five years.

                          When Lisa Su announced it all she talked about was opportunities in datacentre, NICS and 5G. Nothing whatsoever to do with CPU's and GPU's. She did mention $300m synergies in the first year through cost duplication (getting rid of staff) which is nothing new.

                          Happy New Year Caveman nice to see you posting again.
                          My favorite person with the world's most amount of anxiety for video cards just one month ago was saying he never heard of Xilinks, now he is a market expert on the deal.

                          AMD did not buy Xilinks 35 billion for the short term in Data Center or 5G networking. FGPA on it's own will never pay off the deal if that was their goal. Nor did they buy them for 3D stacking chips. There is a reason why the two x86 giants bought the biggest FPGA companies.

                          Moores Law is dying and x86 needs a friend. The idea of offloading to an FPGA is not new, and there are tons of papers on this. FPGA's do a lot of things better than the GPU and CPU from a performance standpoint as well as a power standpoint. This is not to say they are going to replace them, but this about reinforcing them. Actually... I could probably see CDNA being an mostly an FPGA in 5 years or less. You are going to see FPGA logic integrated one way or another. Whether it's on fabric or in the logic itself.


                          Originally posted by caveman-jim View Post
                          Well I wasn't trying to club anyone, just asking cos I didn't get the connection between chiplets and FPGAs
                          I did not take offense, not sure what they are talking about. Chiplets would make it easier to transition task and engines to a custom FPGA without committing your entire architecture to it. At least in my mind. An FPGA for instance can do the ray tracing, handle complex AI, the I/O, as well as the video encoding and decoding and do it more efficiently. If RDNA 3 is chiplet with a decoupled controller die, then things would be set and primed for integration in future RDNA architecture.

                          reply in the Xlinks thread if you would like. : )
                          I'll share a cool link.
                          Last edited by SuperGeil; Dec 30, 2020, 04:47 PM.
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                          Comment


                            #14

                            Comment


                              #15
                              https://wccftech.com/amd-files-mcm-b...o-radeon-gpus/

                              AMD has filed a patent for something that everyone knew would eventually happen: an MCM GPU Chiplet design. Spotted by LaFriteDavid over at Twitter and published on Freepatents.com, the document shows how AMD plans to build a GPU chiplet graphics card that is eerily reminiscent of its MCM based CPU designs. With NVIDIA working on its own MCM design with Hopper architecture, it's about time that we left monolithic GPU designs in the past and enable truly exponential performance growth.

                              The patent points out that one of the reasons why MCM GPUs have not been attempted in the past is due to the high latency between chiplets, programming models and it being harder to implement parallelism. AMD's patent attempts to solve all these problems by using an on-package interconnect it calls the high bandwidth passive crosslink. This would enable each GPU chiplet to communicate with the CPU directly as well as other chiplets via the passive crosslink. Each GPU would also feature its own cache. This design appears to suggest that each GPU chiplet will be a GPU in its own right and fully addressable by the operating system.

                              Not sure if this will be navi3 or more likely later but its interesting nonetheless.
                              I talked to the tree. Thats why they put me away!..." Peter Sellers, The Goon Show
                              Only superficial people cant be superficial... Oscar Wilde

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                              Ignore List: Keystone, Andino... -My Baron, he wishes to inform you that vendetta, as he puts it in the ancient tongue, the art of kanlee is still alive... He does not wish to meet or speak with you...-
                              "Either half my colleagues are enormously stupid, or else the science of darwinism is fully compatible with conventional religious beliefs and equally compatible with atheism." -Stephen Jay Gould, Rock of Ages.
                              "The Intelligibility of the Universe itself needs explanation. It is not the gaps of understanding of the world that points to God but rather the very comprehensibility of scientific and other forms of understanding that requires an explanation." -Richard Swinburne

                              www.realitysandwich.com

                              www.plasma-universe.com/pseudoskepticism/

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by pax View Post
                                https://wccftech.com/amd-files-mcm-b...o-radeon-gpus/



                                Not sure if this will be navi3 or more likely later but its interesting nonetheless.
                                more than likely and in 10 to 12 months

                                I'm getting more and more reasons to wait till next time every day

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by bill dennison View Post
                                  more than likely and in 10 to 12 months

                                  I'm getting more and more reasons to wait till next time every day
                                  Stop it Billy, looks like this isnt happening for years, looks like next new chip for both NV and AMD are still old design.

                                  MCM design for its GPUs after RDNA3
                                  Last edited by Nascar24; Jan 2, 2021, 01:23 PM.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Nascar24 View Post
                                    Stop it Billy, looks like this isnt happening for years, looks like next new chip for both NV and AMD are still old design.

                                    MCM design for its GPUs after RDNA3
                                    keep laughing fuzzball

                                    AMD patent points to new MCM GPU design for RDNA3
                                    https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-p...let-technology

                                    if RDNA 3 is MCM or not RDNA 3 will be out this year and RDNA 4 will be MCM and out next year

                                    the sand is running out of that high wattage hourglass you got fast

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by bill dennison View Post
                                      keep laughing fuzzball



                                      https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-p...let-technology

                                      if RDNA 3 is MCM or not RDNA 3 will be out this year and RDNA 4 will be MCM and out next year

                                      the sand is running out of that high wattage hourglass you got fast
                                      After the jacket changed things up I believe he knows more then us and AMD is years out as well with MCM.

                                      Dont know what to tell ya Billy, I'm happy with my 3080!
                                      Last edited by Nascar24; Jan 2, 2021, 02:43 PM.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Nascar24 View Post
                                        After the jacket changed things up I believe he knows more then us and AMD is years out as well with MCM.

                                        Dont know what to tell ya Billy, I'm happy with my 3080!
                                        AMD is not really MCM it's more like Ryzen

                                        AMD patents a chiplet GPU design quite unlike Nvidia and Intel's
                                        In the new patent dated December 31, AMD outlines a chiplet design fashioned to mimic a monolithic design as closely as possible. Their hypothetical model uses two chiplets connected by a high-speed inactive interposer called a crosslink.

                                        A crosslink connection sits between the L2 cache and L3 cache on the memory hierarchy. Everything beneath it, such as the cores and L1 cache and L2 cache, are aware of their separation from the other chiplet. Everything above, including the L3 cache and GDDR memory, are shared between the chiplets.

                                        This design is beneficial because it is conventional. AMD claims that compute units can access low-level cache on other chiplets almost as fast as they can access local low-level cache. Should that prove true, software won't need updating.

                                        https://www.techspot.com/news/88138-...dia-intel.html

                                        the jacket is at a disadvantage at this point as he can't violate all those Ryzen chiplet & crosslink patents AMD has

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          There are other ways to do it, really doubt patents will be a barrier for either side. That said... I see this more for cloud, server and data crunching than I do gaming from either side.
                                          -Trunks0
                                          not speaking for all and if I am wrong I never said it.
                                          (plz note that is meant as a joke)


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                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            I would be a little surprised if Nvidia has a chiplet design in the pipeline for commercial consumer use to be used in a GUI environment. Hopper is a data center card (I assume) and Lovelace is the commercial card. The problems posed by GPU chiplets are non-issues when it comes to the data center market, which is why Hopper being a chiplet does not need to worry about latency or communication with the CPU. Interesting to note, nonetheless, Hopper is delayed.

                                            A lot of talk about ''Advanced'' node. I think this is being given too much credence for nothing. I think it's just an open-ended question of it could be 6nm, or it could be 5nm.

                                            The way the patent reads is that there will be a single master GPU that communicates to the CPU. This to me suggest that there will be no I/O die. And the logic will and should be the same between the master GPU and slave GPUs. Basically, some redundancy. Not actually a bad thing since there will only be one chip to worry about manufacturing. Now I'm not too sure how each GPU would talk to the Infinity Cache....
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                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by bill dennison View Post
                                              keep laughing fuzzball

                                              https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-p...let-technology

                                              if RDNA 3 is MCM or not RDNA 3 will be out this year and RDNA 4 will be MCM and out next year

                                              the sand is running out of that high wattage hourglass you got fast
                                              Maybe this might enlighten you regarding AMD GPU's in 2021. https://www.techspot.com/news/88121-...2021-meet.html

                                              That doesn't even include M$ and Zen 3. RDNA 3 in 2021 in sufficient numbers is a huge ask and one AMD probably won't be able to do.

                                              Another rumour doing the rounds is the 6800/6900XT are just halo products to prove AMD can compete in the enthusiast segment. They never had any intention of producing large numbers so mass production will be centered on 6700/XT which is where the volume and money is. Sounds plausible as why would they produce load of enthusiast cards into a market where they have zero mark share. Just think about it.
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                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by LordHawkwind View Post
                                                Maybe this might enlighten you regarding AMD GPU's in 2021. https://www.techspot.com/news/88121-...2021-meet.html

                                                That doesn't even include M$ and Zen 3. RDNA 3 in 2021 in sufficient numbers is a huge ask and one AMD probably won't be able to do.

                                                Another rumour doing the rounds is the 6800/6900XT are just halo products to prove AMD can compete in the enthusiast segment. They never had any intention of producing large numbers so mass production will be centered on 6700/XT which is where the volume and money is. Sounds plausible as why would they produce load of enthusiast cards into a market where they have zero mark share. Just think about it.


                                                if they are going to make 16.8 million to 18 million PS5 consoles in 2021
                                                plus near the same xbox's and then their CPU's


                                                they sure won't have the capacity to do mass production on a even bigger seller like a 6700/XT
                                                plus a 6700/XT is most likely a failed 6800/6900XT chip cut down


                                                ........


                                                RDNA 2 maybe a stepping stone to RDNA 3 chiplets and they may never make a lot of any RDNA 2 for lack on TSMC production
                                                and RDNA 2 is the biggest of their chips and most likely with the lowest yields so the logical one to cut


                                                but by Q4 the game consoles sales will be over for the most part and or slowed a lot

                                                and chiplets are easer to make and have better yields
                                                so i still think they will hit or be very close to the RDNA 3 roadmap in 2021
                                                Last edited by bill dennison; Jan 3, 2021, 11:16 AM.

                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  Billy I am putting on the old tin foil hat with all your assumptions! Your going off the deep end. I also believe with 80 percent certainty that RDNA3 is not going to be the chiplet or whatever you want to call it design.

                                                  Comment


                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by Nascar24 View Post
                                                    Billy I am putting on the old tin foil hat with all your assumptions! Your going off the deep end. I also believe with 80 percent certainty that RDNA3 is not going to be the chiplet or whatever you want to call it design.
                                                    bitcoin 33,640.00 United States Dollar

                                                    not going to see a 3080 all year now

                                                    Comment


                                                      #27
                                                      Originally posted by bill dennison View Post
                                                      bitcoin 33,640.00 United States Dollar

                                                      not going to see a 3080 all year now
                                                      Apparently you ride NV harder than AMD even though you believe AMD is focusing more on consoles than RDNA2, which means they aren't even making many cards.
                                                      Originally posted by curio
                                                      Eat this protein bar, for it is of my body. And drink this creatine shake, for it is my blood.
                                                      "If you can't handle me when I'm bulking, you don't deserve me when I'm cut." -- Marilyn Monbroe

                                                      Comment


                                                        #28
                                                        Originally posted by Nunz View Post
                                                        Apparently you ride NV harder than AMD even though you believe AMD is focusing more on consoles than RDNA2, which means they aren't even making many cards.
                                                        NV always deserves it

                                                        but RDNA2 is crap at mining compared to the 3080

                                                        the 5700 xt is better for mining than a 6800 xt or 6900 xt from what i have read so far


                                                        ....

                                                        and i'm not happy with AMD but they made the consoles deal 2+ years ago and no one could predict last year


                                                        .........

                                                        and it was NV's fault they played games with TSMC and lost
                                                        Last edited by bill dennison; Jan 3, 2021, 02:23 PM.

                                                        Comment


                                                          #29
                                                          If Samsung can get their chit together nV stands in a better position to churn out volume by end of Q1 21. TSMC has a better node but they seem to be at capacity.

                                                          Comment


                                                            #30
                                                            Originally posted by acroig View Post
                                                            If Samsung can get their chit together nV stands in a better position to churn out volume by end of Q1 21. TSMC has a better node but they seem to be at capacity.
                                                            sorry ampere would have been killer on TSMC lower watts and higher OC
                                                            and no mater what it won't on Samsung ever .

                                                            and with crapcoin at 33k+ and rising and it doing well mining Samsung will never make enough now

                                                            Comment


                                                              #31
                                                              With the low amount of 6K cards out there the jacket made the right choice going with Samsung, who cares if it’s better but can’t buy a card. The 6K series are far more vapor ware then the 3k series.

                                                              Comment


                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by Nascar24 View Post
                                                                With the low amount of 6K cards out there the jacket made the right choice going with Samsung, who cares if it’s better but can’t buy a card. The 6K series are far more vapor ware then the 3k series.
                                                                but the infinity cache kills the 6000's for mining and the 3080 is the top mining card on the market now

                                                                you won't see a 3080 at MSRP till Bitcoin crashes again it is the 1080 ti again only worse

                                                                my 1080 ti Strix went from 779.99 to 1600 bucks 3 weeks after i got it and stayed that way almost till the 2080 ti came out

                                                                NV sold a crap ton of 1080 ti's directly to miners
                                                                is it odd that the 3080 does so well at mining and is nowhere to be seen but ebay and mining

                                                                remember

                                                                Nvidia Disguised $1B in ‘Fickle’ Crypto Mining Sales as Gaming Revenue, Lawsuit Claims
                                                                https://www.coindesk.com/nvidia-disg...evenue-lawsuit

                                                                ...........

                                                                even with low volume the 6000's may be easer to find in a few months

                                                                Comment


                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by bill dennison View Post
                                                                  sorry ampere would have been killer on TSMC lower watts and higher OC
                                                                  and no mater what it won't on Samsung ever .

                                                                  and with crapcoin at 33k+ and rising and it doing well mining Samsung will never make enough now
                                                                  I don't see Samsung 5nm being much better. Their 8nm process is already incredibly inefficient with low yield; there is little chance their 5nm fares much better.

                                                                  Regardless of what the card would be like on TSMC, at least you can actually get one. Granted it's a pain in the ass, but I'm regularly seeing stock drop. If the option is either a Samsung 8nm with minimal stock vs a TSMC 7nm with no stock (because they're letting consoles eat up all supply) then I'll take the 8nm card every day.

                                                                  TSMC is completely swamped. This is the issue when you allow one manufacturing company essentially monopolize the market. As much as you all hate Intel, they at least were superior and created competition in that industry. Now you have Samsung who is miles behind, and an Intel that people chastise for 14nm+800, even though the density of their 14nm is really not comparable to what that 14nm started out with. It's an issue blown out of proportion by the market. Honestly unless Intel can get their fabrication back in shape, the industry will be completely ****ed and overpriced because TSMC will have their entire hands wrapped around every single chip maker in the market.

                                                                  If you think cards were expensive this year, just wait. TSMC is already price-gouging for their 7nm; if things continue on this path, and you thought cards were expensive this year? you're in for a rude awakening.
                                                                  Originally posted by curio
                                                                  Eat this protein bar, for it is of my body. And drink this creatine shake, for it is my blood.
                                                                  "If you can't handle me when I'm bulking, you don't deserve me when I'm cut." -- Marilyn Monbroe

                                                                  Comment


                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by bill dennison View Post
                                                                    sorry ampere would have been killer on TSMC lower watts and higher OC
                                                                    and no mater what it won't on Samsung ever .

                                                                    and with crapcoin at 33k+ and rising and it doing well mining Samsung will never make enough now
                                                                    Possibly yes but you have not addressed TSMC being up to capacity.

                                                                    Comment


                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by acroig View Post
                                                                      Possibly yes but you have not addressed TSMC being up to capacity.
                                                                      doesn't fly .

                                                                      they had their normal slot and capacity reserved at TSMC till they started playing we want a better price because we are big bad NVidia games

                                                                      and big bad TSMC told them to go get stuffed " so you don't want it ok we just sold it to AMD .... bye bye "

                                                                      with their normal slot and capacity and TSMC much better yields they might have been the same or better

                                                                      Comment


                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by bill dennison View Post
                                                                        doesn't fly .

                                                                        they had their normal slot and capacity reserved at TSMC till they started playing we want a better price because we are big bad NVidia games

                                                                        and big bad TSMC told them to go get stuffed " so you don't want it ok we just sold it to AMD .... bye bye "

                                                                        with their normal slot and capacity and TSMC much better yields they might have been the same or better
                                                                        Originally posted by Nunz View Post
                                                                        I don't see Samsung 5nm being much better. Their 8nm process is already incredibly inefficient with low yield; there is little chance their 5nm fares much better.

                                                                        Regardless of what the card would be like on TSMC, at least you can actually get one. Granted it's a pain in the ass, but I'm regularly seeing stock drop. If the option is either a Samsung 8nm with minimal stock vs a TSMC 7nm with no stock (because they're letting consoles eat up all supply) then I'll take the 8nm card every day.

                                                                        TSMC is completely swamped. This is the issue when you allow one manufacturing company essentially monopolize the market. As much as you all hate Intel, they at least were superior and created competition in that industry. Now you have Samsung who is miles behind, and an Intel that people chastise for 14nm+800, even though the density of their 14nm is really not comparable to what that 14nm started out with. It's an issue blown out of proportion by the market. Honestly unless Intel can get their fabrication back in shape, the industry will be completely ****ed and overpriced because TSMC will have their entire hands wrapped around every single chip maker in the market.

                                                                        If you think cards were expensive this year, just wait. TSMC is already price-gouging for their 7nm; if things continue on this path, and you thought cards were expensive this year? you're in for a rude awakening.
                                                                        What Nunz said is spot on IMHO.

                                                                        Comment


                                                                          #37
                                                                          Originally posted by acroig View Post
                                                                          What Nunz said is spot on IMHO.
                                                                          no

                                                                          the cards weren't expensive this time that was last time and turing was 12nm

                                                                          AMD seems to be doing fine with 7nm prices on a lot more parts for a lot longer

                                                                          no NV screwed the pooch with TSMC and maybe for a long time because the jacket wanted a higher profit margin not for card prices .








                                                                          ...................

                                                                          AMD Radeon Navi 21 XTXH Variant Spotted, Another Flagship Graphics Card Incoming?
                                                                          https://www.techpowerup.com/276747/a...-card-incoming
                                                                          Last edited by bill dennison; Jan 4, 2021, 09:58 AM.

                                                                          Comment


                                                                            #38
                                                                            Countries are starting to be more and more concerned about hardware level security and we are starting to see plans to invest large amounts of capital into chip manufacturing research to be able to compete with the likes of TSMC so shorty term TSMC may be ahead but we could start seeing state level competition within the next decade.
                                                                            Main rig: look at system spec tab
                                                                            Storage Server: Dual AMD Opteron 6120 CPUs, 64Gigs ECC Ram 50TB usable space across 3 zfs2 pools


                                                                            HOURGLASS = most appropriate named ICON/CURSOR in the Windows world :-)

                                                                            In a dank corner of ATI central, the carpet covered with corn flakes, the faint sound of clicking can be heard........Click......click, click............as the fate of the graphics world and the future of the human race hangs in the balance.

                                                                            I know....I know........Keep my day job :-)- catcather

                                                                            Comment


                                                                              #39
                                                                              Originally posted by Gandalfthewhite View Post
                                                                              Countries are starting to be more and more concerned about hardware level security and we are starting to see plans to invest large amounts of capital into chip manufacturing research to be able to compete with the likes of TSMC so shorty term TSMC may be ahead but we could start seeing state level competition within the next decade.
                                                                              well they are putting a tsmc fab in arizona

                                                                              they say 2024 it should go online

                                                                              Comment


                                                                                #40
                                                                                I was talking more about the EU and China. US technically has Intel and are putting up foreign businesses plants in their borders we will see how that goes. Hopefully it is not another foxconn
                                                                                Main rig: look at system spec tab
                                                                                Storage Server: Dual AMD Opteron 6120 CPUs, 64Gigs ECC Ram 50TB usable space across 3 zfs2 pools


                                                                                HOURGLASS = most appropriate named ICON/CURSOR in the Windows world :-)

                                                                                In a dank corner of ATI central, the carpet covered with corn flakes, the faint sound of clicking can be heard........Click......click, click............as the fate of the graphics world and the future of the human race hangs in the balance.

                                                                                I know....I know........Keep my day job :-)- catcather

                                                                                Comment

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