Official AMD Radeon RX 7000 Series (RDNA 3) Thread

[Nascar24]

i don't like it sorry if that offends you but i don't really give a Sh*t

Settle down there Billy!

[SuperGeil]

So it looks like Infinity Cache is here to stay and will be doubling up on several duties

-Last level cache pool for GPU chiplets
-Bridge for chiplet communication
-AI learning
-Bridge for graphics board memory and chiplets
-Bridge for CPU and graphics chiplet communication

FPGA's excel at all of that. A topic for the RDNA 4 thread I'm sure.

[NIGELG]

Looking forward to AMD continuing to grow and be a force to be reckoned with.

I'm with Intel/Nvidia for now but I will be watching how AMD grows from here.

I am a big fan of AMD as my past rants will show but the lack of availability of their CPU's and GPU's has made me not buy from them this time but it's good that they are a force to be reckoned with now.

Go AMD!!!!!!!

[acroig]

Looking forward to AMD continuing to grow and be a force to be reckoned with.

I'm with Intel/Nvidia for now but I will be watching how AMD grows from here.

I am a big fan of AMD as my past rants will show but the lack of availability of their CPU's and GPU's has made me not buy from them this time but it's good that they are a force to be reckoned with now.

Go AMD!!!!!!!

+1

[Gandalfthewhite]

yeah for anyone building a new rig I basically have to tell them to go Intel. For anyone doing prebuilts I point them towards AMD. ( have helped with 6 new builds in the last 3 months)

[acroig]

https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-could-outsource-some-of-its-APU-and-GPU-production-to-Samsung-in-the-near-future.517679.0.html

Wow if true.

[Nunz]

TSMC giving Apple the large majority of it's 5nm really ****ed a lot of the manufacturers.

I wonder if we'll see regulation at some point about how much of a node a company can buy. Right now, the limiting factor of supply is how many wafers can you get. Companies like Apple throwing $$ at TSMC to let them buy up the large majority and hold back other manufacturers.. sigh.

This is why we need Intel to revitalize their fabs. We are all so very ****ed in the next 4 years if this continues. Samsung has proven they aren't up to par; all that leaves is Intel to get their **** together.

We need a new fab, but it's so expensive and so advanced that you can't just jump into this market anymore. IMO, it doesn't look good for consumers.

[pax]

AMD has a lot of 7nm allocation and still cant make them fast enough and did buy 5nm early so to go to samsung for its low end gpus and apus makes sense if they are still unable to provide for the market.

Id sooner like to see amd cpus and high end gpus stay on tsmc if they can free up their own allocation.

[bill dennison]

people don't need a new Apple iPhone every ****ing year
now that the 12 has 5g it good for 3 or 4 years till 5g actually works

Apple needs to be told to wait or build their own fab .
they will suck up 100% of TSMC production by 2024 and the new fab after if they let them

and AMD should shift the game consoles to Samsung

[pax]

Dont think samsung is that bad either they are just behind tsmc. If samsung 7nm was available at the time wed have seen the 3080 on it with better tdp than the 8nm they had to use. Also with demand the way it is we can expect intel and samsung to invest heavily on the new nodes like tsmc has.

[LordHawkwind]

TSMC giving Apple the large majority of it's 5nm really ****ed a lot of the manufacturers.

I wonder if we'll see regulation at some point about how much of a node a company can buy. Right now, the limiting factor of supply is how many wafers can you get. Companies like Apple throwing $$ at TSMC to let them buy up the large majority and hold back other manufacturers.. sigh.

This is why we need Intel to revitalize their fabs. We are all so very ****ed in the next 4 years if this continues. Samsung has proven they aren't up to par; all that leaves is Intel to get their **** together.

We need a new fab, but it's so expensive and so advanced that you can't just jump into this market anymore. IMO, it doesn't look good for consumers.

Nunz this is rampant American capitalism at it's finest. Apple has more money than anyone else so they can do what they want. TSMC are Taiwanese nothing any regulators can or would be able to do. TSMC shareholders want the most profit so shares rise in value and dividends are paid. Simple.

AMD has a lot of 7nm allocation and still cant make them fast enough and did buy 5nm early so to go to samsung for its low end gpus and apus makes sense if they are still unable to provide for the market.

Id sooner like to see amd cpus and high end gpus stay on tsmc if they can free up their own allocation.

At the moment it's nothing to do with the nodes it's wafer allocation. TSMC are being pressured by their Government, who are being pressured by the USA to allocate more wafers to auto manufacturers which is going to hurt everyone else except Apple of course. TSMC are doing it because they have no choice.

people don't need a new Apple iPhone every ****ing year now that the 12 has 5g it good for 3 or 4 years till 5g actually works

Apple needs to be told to wait or build their own fab. they will suck up 100% of TSMC production by 2024 and the new fab after if they let them

and AMD should shift the game consoles to Samsung

Firstly AMD can't move consoles to Samsung it's a different node and I don't think M$ and $ony would be happy and they're paying the big bills. Most Apple consumers are on at least a 2 year upgrade cycle not one year. People looking to upgrade are more likely owners of iPhone X and iPhone 11 not iPhone 12. My wife upgraded her iPhone 8 Max to 12 Max pro so that's why Apple produce a new phone each year because there are always people on older phones who will upgrade.

Personally I'm in the Samsung upgrade programme so I do upgrade every year and received my S21 last Thursday. Hopefully the S22 Exynos chip will have an AMD GPU fingers crossed.

[bill dennison]

BS

AMD could move the game consoles to Samsung 7nm and M$ and Sony would be more than happy if they can get more chips

[acroig]

BS

AMD could move the game consoles to Samsung 7nm and M$ and Sony would be more than happy if they can get more chips

You're not thinking clearly. Sony and MS are a big part of AMD's income and they will not upset that in any way. The chips will continue to flow to them.

[pax]

Ya but obviously with a shortage if Samsung 7nm is available but runs a bit hotter Im sure Sony and MS will slap a bit better cooling to get more of those consoles out the door.

I suppose it all depends how big a diff theres is between Samsung 7nm and regular DUV 7nm from TSMC that AMD stayed on vs EUV probably due to better volumes...

[Nunz]

Samsung 7nm and TSMC 7nm are not the same thing. Sony/MS would not risk product failure and/or further supply chain disruption by having their wafers move to a different fab.

Contracts are written already anyway.

[bill dennison]

You're not thinking clearly. Sony and MS are a big part of AMD's income and they will not upset that in any way. The chips will continue to flow to them.

and they are not getting enough now and screaming for more

if a move to Samsung 7nm could get them a lot more APU's they would take it in a heart beat even if it is a few more watts
and the game consoles APU's are smaller and lower watt anyway

and AMD has used Samsung before in the past long before NV
IF TSMC will let them move the consoles APU's Samsung would bend over for AMD and scream give to me

and who is using Samsung 7nm now not NV they went 8nm
you just fear AMD using Samsung up also and shorting NV Lovelace and beyond

and it is true they most likely will sooner or later fab capacity goes to the biggest orders and AMD is second after Apple now in that at TSMC

[bill dennison]

Samsung 7nm and TSMC 7nm are not the same thing. Sony/MS would not risk product failure and/or further supply chain disruption by having their wafers move to a different fab.

Contracts are written already anyway.

what disruption they could continue with TSMC till Samsung is up and running then stop TSMC or make them on both

[acroig]

Samsung 7nm and TSMC 7nm are not the same thing. Sony/MS would not risk product failure and/or further supply chain disruption by having their wafers move to a different fab.

Contracts are written already anyway.

I agree and add that it's likely MS and Sony have specified the fab to use to guarantee production and capacity.

[LordHawkwind]

what disruption they could continue with TSMC till Samsung is up and running then stop TSMC or make them on both

Bill think it through. AMD only provide the SoC to M$ & $ony. All other components including cooling are outsourced to other companies to make the final Xbox or PS5. If you change the SoC it basically screws everything else up.

You said a few more watts really? That affects cooling so who's going to pay for that? M$ & $ony wouldn't. Don't think AMD can do you?

As Nunz said more product failure, supply disruption AMD could go out of business with all the ensuing lawsuits and damages. Think like a business person not an enthusiast. If this rumour is true forget about RDN3 till 2023.

[bill dennison]

then there is this and it is true all the fabs are ****ed

Report: Packaging Issues, PS5 Demand May Be Hurting TSMC Production

Reports from fall, 2020 suggested that TSMC was working through a shortage of ABF substrate. ABF (Ajinomoto Build-up Film) is a resin that insulates modern ICs and resists expansion and contraction based on changes in temperature. Connections bridging the gap between the nanoscale (IC) and millimeter-scale (packaging) are made through an ABF layer

ABF is incredibly important to the chip-packaging process, and an ongoing shortage is hitting pretty much everyone who employs advanced packaging standards. This could fit our criteria for an important piece of the overall explanation of what’s going on, because this isn’t an issue that would impact just Nvidia, AMD, Intel, or any other single company. If TSMC can’t buy enough of it, the impact could ripple out across the market, hitting a number of companies. Apple, Qualcomm, and Samsung all use ABF as well. DigiTimes reported on a shortage at least as early as June 2020 and claimed it could widen and worsen in 2021. That prediction seems to have borne fruit.

TSMC’s major suppliers for ABF are all rumored to be experiencing ongoing shortages. There are rumors that AMD can’t currently meet demand for notebooks because of the ABF problem and that the issue could worsen in Q3 2021 when Zen 3 notebooks come to market. Up until now, we’ve heard a lot of rumors that the shortages would ease in March-April 2021, but if the ABF angle is true, it could take longer.

https://www.extremetech.com/computing/318937-report-packaging-issues-ps5-demand-may-be-hurting-tsmc-production

[bill dennison]

Bill think it through. AMD only provide the SoC to M$ & $ony. All other components including cooling are outsourced to other companies to make the final Xbox or PS5. If you change the SoC it basically screws everything else up.

You said a few more watts really? That affects cooling so who's going to pay for that? M$ & $ony wouldn't. Don't think AMD can do you?

As Nunz said more product failure, supply disruption AMD could go out of business with all the ensuing lawsuits and damages. Think like a business person not an enthusiast. If this rumour is true forget about RDN3 till 2023.

yes

i think they could if allowed by TSMC come up with a APU that worked the same and has the same pinout on Samsung 7nm

The PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X each draw 160 to 200+ watts of electricity when used,

that's the whole thing
that's nothing to a 3090 500 watt card only

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articl...60%2Dinch%20TV.

the greens won't like it but so what it it up's it say 25 watts

but then Samsung may not have the ABF substrate to make them either

[pax]

Ya I mean even if samsung 7nm would push the heat to 250w it could easily be handled by a slightly better cooling unit. I really doubt MS and Sony would forsake that many more sales, likely in the millions of consoles, just to stick with TSMC only.

[Nunz]

Yeah I'm sure Sony or MS are going to redesign the cooling unit ..

You guys are smoking crack.

[acroig]

Yeah I'm sure Sony or MS are going to redesign the cooling unit ..

You guys are smoking crack.

, tru.dat

[bill dennison]

Yeah I'm sure Sony or MS are going to redesign the cooling unit ..

You guys are smoking crack.

, tru.dat

yea much better with no or less product to sell than maybe a small cooler redesign
if needed at all as it could end up the same watts or small enough to be in spec of current cooler

[acroig]

yea much better with no or less product to sell than maybe a small cooler redesign
if needed at all as it could end up the same watts or small enough to be in spec of current cooler

Bill get serious, AMD is not gonna tell their two biggest customers to redesign their coolers so they can have more fab product for themselves.

[pax]

I mean it could be a mix like a slight redesign of a cooler maybe as simple as a new fan that pushes a bit more air... 50w wouldnt be a big obstacle vs current tsmc apus and reflects the current 3080 tdp vs 6900xt tdp of about 20%. And those are on diff nodes.

But if you can make a few million more consoles in the next year you wont because... reasons?

[SuperGeil]

More complete story here

The firm is reportedly considering having some of its APIs and GPUs manufactured by Samsung, and Techpowerup speculates that the company could be planning to leverage the company’s 8nm manufacturing process for mid-range GPUs other less critical product lines.

AMD could also be one of the first companies to utilize the company's upcoming 3nm facilities, although the company is still said to be weighing up its options before shifting production to Samsung.

AMD and Samsung do already have an existing relationship; the companies are currently working on a custom mobile GPU that will be utilized for upcoming Samsung Exynos processors.

''wow if true"

[bill dennison]

I mean it could be a mix like a slight redesign of a cooler maybe as simple as a new fan that pushes a bit more air... 50w wouldnt be a big obstacle vs current tsmc apus and reflects the current 3080 tdp vs 6900xt tdp of about 20%. And those are on diff nodes.

But if you can make a few million more consoles in the next year you wont because... reasons?

can't leave NV wanting fab space

[pax]

When I think of it it may explain the delay for 6700xt and other lower skus. If its as late as end of q2 it maybe because they moved it to samsung. Possibly increasing 7nm allocation at tsmc to consoles in the process...

Also a small 8 or 7 nm samsung made gpu may still yield/clock well enough to do it.

[Nunz]

But if you can make a few million more consoles in the next year you wont because... reasons?

There's more to it than just doing it, and you know it. There's contracts that already exist with TSMC, which I'm sure they wouldn't be happy about losing future production to their main competition in the fabrication market. Sony/MS both agreeing to redesigning coolers, new contracts written with Samsung, and the fact that Samsung and TSMC nodes are completely different, so who knows how the architecture lines up on Samsung 8nm. This is only the limitations I can think of, I can only imagine what other restrictions and contracts are involved that I don't/can't think of.

Different sizes, densities, etc.. you guys are living in fairyland for some insane reason. Come join the rest of us back in reality.

[Nascar24]

Billy you have moved to the loony bin with your talk Nothing will be moving around this gen.

[pax]

There's more to it than just doing it, and you know it. There's contracts that already exist with TSMC, which I'm sure they wouldn't be happy about losing future production to their main competition in the fabrication market. Sony/MS both agreeing to redesigning coolers, new contracts written with Samsung, and the fact that Samsung and TSMC nodes are completely different, so who knows how the architecture lines up on Samsung 8nm. This is only the limitations I can think of, I can only imagine what other restrictions and contracts are involved that I don't/can't think of.

Different sizes, densities, etc.. you guys are living in fairyland for some insane reason. Come join the rest of us back in reality.

TSMC wont be losing squat for years... they are maxed out. If anything if TSMC cant meet obligations it opens up the ability for buyers to go elsewhere.

[acroig]

If anything if TSMC cant meet obligations it opens up the ability for buyers to go elsewhere.

Remind me who has another 7nm fab waiting for those buyers?

[bill dennison]

Remind me who has another 7nm fab waiting for those buyers?

your the one that started this with

AMD could outsource some of its APU and GPU production to Samsung in the near future

https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-could-outsource-some-of-its-APU-and-GPU-production-to-Samsung-in-the-near-future.517679.0.html

.........

if they can outsource a APU or low or midrange GPU then they can outsource a game console SOC also
as Samsung wants something from AMD also

AMD graphics cards are coming to Samsung phones

https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/samsung-smartphones

..............

and give me a fu*king brake we have had to listened to months and months of rumors and people here how NV was going to switch ampere back to TSMC 7nm but that was fine

but say one word about AMD outsourcing game console SOC's to Samsung and it's the end of the world

[acroig]

your the one that started this with

https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-could-outsource-some-of-its-APU-and-GPU-production-to-Samsung-in-the-near-future.517679.0.html

and give me a fu*king brake we have had to listened to months and months of rumors and people here how NV was going to switch ampere back to TSMC 7nm but that was fine

but say one word about AMD outsourcing game console SOC's to Samsung and it's the end of the world

I think the point is that TSMC has no capacity, nV can't do it until the far future, AMD can't get more out of them and outsourcing MS/Sony chips won't work.

[Nunz]

It's different when it's AMD or NV's direct designs that affect no one but themselves. This isn't nearly the same as it involves another party and the contracts and litigations that have already been made. You can't seriously think it's even remotely close to the same situation, right?

[bill dennison]

I think the point is that TSMC has no capacity, nV can't do it until the far future, AMD can't get more out of them and outsourcing MS/Sony chips won't work.

and i think that is BS .

"if they can APU's or low or midrange GPU's then they can outsource a game console SOC"

and Samsung does have capacity and it would free up capacity at TSMC for CPU's and high end GPU's that don't do so well on Samsung

maybe even some NV ones later in the year like maybe a 3080 ti
but it would kill the 3090 flat out

[bill dennison]

It's different when it's AMD or NV's direct designs that affect no one but themselves. This isn't nearly the same as it involves another party and the contracts and litigations that have already been made. You can't seriously think it's even remotely close to the same situation, right?

from all reports AMD has more than filled their contracts
but now they want more & more now that AMD has switched their TSMC capacity to their own CPU's and GPU's more as planed

they don't get 100% of AMD's TSMC capacity forever and i'm sure that was in the contracts lisa su isn't stupid
but now they need and want it
hell they want 100% of TSMC's full 7nm capacity now **** Apple

they would bend to need if they can get more chips .

[LordHawkwind]

Billy look at it this way. The consoles are not AMD products. They only make the SoC. Can you imagine either M$ or $ony accepting two variants of their consoles where one might be different than the other? They've paid AMD for only one console SoC and that is all they want. AMD is minuscule compared to those two behemoths so really do you think that's going to happen?