R3X0 can only support 2048x2048?

[DarkSithPro]

http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?im...xfN181X2wuanBn


The engine reports ATI cards can only do 2048x2048, but Nvidia FX can do 4092x4096. What does this mean for textures in games such as Far Cry? Is 2048 good enough?

[PreservedSwine]

You must have one expensive monitor

[DarkSithPro]

Originally posted by PreservedSwine
You must have one expensive monitor

I'm talking about Texture size, not monitor res.

[mbeeston]

lol.. so far the hiest use texture res is 2048x2048 ... their not worried about it till it's needed

[Twinke Masta]

Hell, but still te 9800XT gives off a richer more realistic unblurred filtered texture than the 5950, when the images are blurred it doesn't really matter... not to mention the massive performance sacrifice..plus not many games use even 2048x2048.

[Brent]

Re: R3X0 can only support 2048x2048?

Originally posted by DarkSithPro
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?im...xfN181X2wuanBn


The engine reports ATI cards can only do 2048x2048, but Nvidia FX can do 4092x4096. What does this mean for textures in games such as Far Cry? Is 2048 good enough?

2048x2048 textures sizes are plenty for right now, heh

not many games use textures that high anyways yet

1024x1024 and 512x512 are most common right now

it isn't a major concern right now

[DarkSithPro]

Re: Re: R3X0 can only support 2048x2048?

Originally posted by Brent
2048x2048 textures sizes are plenty for right now, heh

not many games use textures that high anyways yet

1024x1024 and 512x512 are most common right now

it isn't a major concern right now

Maybe you could put a short note in the review, so the n00bs don't freak out

[Gandalfthewhite]

yeah the only thing taht uses texture sizes taht big is a gfx plugin for PSX emulaters

[Brent]

actually, i read on the Painkiller website the full version game will use up to 2048x2048 textures, quoting from the site:

The textures are also very hi-res: average is 1024x1024 bosses are 2048x2048!

[EMunEeE]

Texture sizes of 2048x2048 has been the standard texture size for a long time. I have not seen anygames that use bigger textures than that.

[OpenGL guy]

Originally posted by MrEMan4k
Texture sizes of 2048x2048 has been the standard texture size for a long time. I have not seen anygames that use bigger textures than that.

I've not seen a single game use a 2048x2048 texture.

[ChrisRay]

There is an aplication that uses Max Texture sizes for Nvidia cards,

Petes OpenGL 2.0 plugin. And it makes a huge difference over the other ones.

[EMunEeE]

Originally posted by OpenGL guy
I've not seen a single game use a 2048x2048 texture.

I agree, I have not seen any games that use textures the size of 2048x2048 either.

[ChrisRay]

Originally posted by OpenGL guy
I've not seen a single game use a 2048x2048 texture.

Is it a driver issue or a card Limitation? I know people with ATI cards whod love to have a much higher texture size So they can dramatically improve Quality in Playstation 2 Emulation.

and the difference is dramatic.










High texture Sizes.











Max Texture Sizes ((Currently not supported on ATI cards and would love to see my 9500 Pro work with it, But Geforce 4 TI's and Geforce FX cards support it))




Since Anti Aliasing doesnt work in his Plugins do to his rendering technique (Pbuffer) This is an extremely effective Way of increasing Quality. And It's a Shame its not supported by ATI currently cards.

[Trunks0]

Yea but gimme a screen shot using 2048 for comparison(unless the above one was). And while iam sure there is a difference for such small textures like the one on that model it shouldn't make a difference

[spyre]

Hardware limitation, I asked

[dark_preacher]

Originally posted by OpenGL guy
I've not seen a single game use a 2048x2048 texture.

FF XI

[spajdr]

Silent Hill 3 can use 2048x2048, but it didnt work (no visual difference) and also runs really slow when running at that texture resolution, so did it work actually?

[ChrisRay]

Originally posted by Trunks0
Yea but gimme a screen shot using 2048 for comparison(unless the above one was). And while iam sure there is a difference for such small textures like the one on that model it shouldn't make a difference

Did.

[Gandalfthewhite]

thanks for the screenies chris. Yeah its a hardware limitation of the current generation dont know if it will be the same on R420 or not (i hope not)

[drumphil]

I thought it was stated in the r3xx specs all along, that the max texture size was 2048x2048... I allways thought that 2038x texture support was a feature of, rather than a limitation of the r3xx line. Well, it was when the 9700 came out anyway.

[tEd]

the most use of such high res textures is to use as a render target to simulate Super-Sampling AA. Silent hill3 and beyond good and evil does that maybe some more.

[Humus]

Textures are commonly sized 512x512. That's the standard res I use in my demos. 2048x2048 is more than enough for the vast majority of the games out there. Of course supporting higher res is a good thing, but the significance of that is close to zero right now. Have in mind that a 2048x2048x32 texture would require 16MB. A 4096x4096 would take 64MB. It's not a texture size you're going to use regularly.

[TheMonkeyBoyz]

Re: R3X0 can only support 2048x2048?

Originally posted by DarkSithPro
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?im...xfN181X2wuanBn


The engine reports ATI cards can only do 2048x2048, but Nvidia FX can do 4092x4096. What does this mean for textures in games such as Far Cry? Is 2048 good enough?

You mean 4096x4096, not 4092x4096, right?

Heck, I did not know anyone actually used textures larger than 512x512 or maybe
1024x1024. Didn't Diakatana use 256x256?

I have to admit, the textures in the full game of UT2003 do look pretty impressive.
The demo had low-quality textures, but the full game seemed to rock.

What texture size has UT2003 been using?

[TheMonkeyBoyz]

Originally posted by tEd
the most use of such high res textures is to use as a render target to simulate Super-Sampling AA. Silent hill3 and beyond good and evil does that maybe some more.

What is this super sampling I hear of?

Is it just a totally high-end version of regular AA that we use with the Radeon line
or something? 4x AA is not good quality in comparison?

Just askin'...

Thanks

[m$-MaNiAC]

Will the R420 support 4096x4096 or higher?

I played Unreal & Quake3 S3TC levels, and those textures were 8192x8192... is not possible to use S3TC with the PS/2 emulators?

BTW. Does anybody know were to find those Q3 S3TC levels again... i have lost them, and would like to have them again.

[Exxtreme]

Originally posted by OpenGL guy
I've not seen a single game use a 2048x2048 texture.

Daniel Vogel (Epic-employee) meant that some UT2003-maps contain some 2048x2048 textures.

[TheMonkeyBoyz]

Is it just a matter of density? Or are environments getting so big inside of games that
2048x2048 textures are really needed?

I mean - that is a HUGE piece of graphical real estate! If you run at 1024x768 you
cannot see the entire texture at one time. Is it that having such a large texture
simply helps continuity and detail as you move through and/or past an area?

I'm not certain I understand the full need for such large textures given the resolutions
that we run games at currently.

Must be missing something fairly obvious, I reckon'.

[Johnmcl7]

Originally posted by TheMonkeyBoyz
What is this super sampling I hear of?

Is it just a totally high-end version of regular AA that we use with the Radeon line
or something? 4x AA is not good quality in comparison?

Just askin'...

Thanks

Super sampling offers better quality and works with more games, however it comes at a higher performance cost, which is why current Radeon cards use MSAA, look at this thread:

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthre...20&pagenumbr=1

John

[Derek Baker]

Originally posted by OpenGL guy
I've not seen a single game use a 2048x2048 texture.

Operation Flashpoint: Resistance.


Derek

[KillarXT]

Silent Hill 3 can use 2048x2048 textures and my Radeon 9800 XT lagged as hell when i try use them but with 1024x1024 all was fine.

[VIVOtheFURY]

Textures that large might make sense in two scenarios:

1. HDTV 1920x1080 resolutions and above.

2. Supersampled AA at higher resolutions

Note the 2048x2048 size is big enough to allow VMR9 to render HDTV resolution on a 3D texture. I believe this would be critical to the new PCI-express High Def video editing capabilities.

[DarkSithPro]

Re: Re: R3X0 can only support 2048x2048?

Originally posted by TheMonkeyBoyz
You mean 4096x4096, not 4092x4096, right?

Heck, I did not know anyone actually used textures larger than 512x512 or maybe
1024x1024. Didn't Diakatana use 256x256?

I have to admit, the textures in the full game of UT2003 do look pretty impressive.
The demo had low-quality textures, but the full game seemed to rock.

What texture size has UT2003 been using?

Yes, sorry was a typo. Well it's good to know that Humus. So if a 4096*4096 texture takes 64 megs then there is no way it can be used for practical use with todays cards. No why does Nvidia support such high textures when their cards cannot even use them at acceptable speeds? Does Nvidia like to include special features that are realisticly useless?

[Trunks0]

uak

I think its more of about just pushing things as far as they can. One extra feature here or there can't hurt and just gives you one more thing over your competior.

Just like the orginal Radeons had EMBM while the Geforce2 series didn't. Yes EMBM is an amazing feature and was apart of the DX7 spec. But Almost no games used it and the few that did made poor use of it OR the EMBM was made to work only on matrox cards(expenables for example)

nVidia saw somthing that could be an interesting feature and could help there low end line down the road and went with it I geuss

Originally posted by m$-MaNiAC
BTW. Does anybody know were to find those Q3 S3TC levels again... i have lost them, and would like to have them again.

I used to have them all when I had my Savage4(also had S3 Quake2 levels). But I no longer have them it seems

However I can give you the names of the 7 S3 levels for Quake3 to make them easier to track down. But you will also need tha special Quake3 EXE to even load them :\

-Asunder - dmmq3dm1
-The Crossroads - dmmq3dm2
-Lonely Planet - dmmq3dm3
-Last Rites - dmmq3dm4
-Face to Fate - dmmq3dm5
-Bad Blood - dmmq3dm6
-Conflicting Interests - dmmq3dm7

[TheMonkeyBoyz]

Originally posted by m$-MaNiAC
Will the R420 support 4096x4096 or higher?

I played Unreal & Quake3 S3TC levels, and those textures were 8192x8192... is not possible to use S3TC with the PS/2 emulators?

BTW. Does anybody know were to find those Q3 S3TC levels again... i have lost them, and would like to have them again.

Serious? 8192x8192? How could they even be displayed on a 2048x2048 limited
system? Just because they are compressed does not mean resized, right?

[m$-MaNiAC]

They used compression... ' TheMonkeyBoyz'

Thank you 'Trunks0'

[m$-MaNiAC]

Found them...

http://www.labtop.com/~thund3r/pub/q3/maps/dmm-s3tc/

[update] Faster mirror
ftp://ftp.edome.net/online/kartat/dmmq3dm1.zip
ftp://ftp.edome.net/online/kartat/dmmq3dm2.zip
ftp://ftp.edome.net/online/kartat/dmmq3dm3.zip
ftp://ftp.edome.net/online/kartat/dmmq3dm4.zip
ftp://ftp.edome.net/online/kartat/dmmq3dm5.zip
ftp://ftp.edome.net/online/kartat/dmmq3dm6.zip
ftp://ftp.edome.net/online/kartat/dmmq3dm7.zip
[/update]
Instructions:
0. Only works on version 1.15, and only works with modded exe
1. Install Quake 3(1.15)
2. Copy the exe to the 'x:\Q3\' folder
3. Copy the maps to the 'x:\Q3\baseq3' folder
4. Goto the 'Q3' folder
5. Klik on the 'dmmq3.exe' file to start the modded Quake 3.
6. Enter the Console by pressing '~'
7. Enter then 'Devmap dmmq3dm1'

List of availabel maps: Thanks to 'Thunks0'
Asunder - dmmq3dm1
-The Crossroads - dmmq3dm2
-Lonely Planet - dmmq3dm3
-Last Rites - dmmq3dm4
-Face to Fate - dmmq3dm5
-Bad Blood - dmmq3dm6
-Conflicting Interests - dmmq3dm7

[TheMonkeyBoyz]

Originally posted by m$-MaNiAC
They used compression... ' TheMonkeyBoyz'

But compression only shrinks the amount of memory the textures use, right?

Not the actual physical size?

[spyre]

TheMonkeyBoyz is right

Compression just shrinks the memory size, if the hardware cant display it then it wont get displayed at that resolution. its common sense

The texture would get resized to a resolution the card can display

[m$-MaNiAC]

I have played them anyway...

AFAIK the textures in those levels are 8192x8192.. maybe they are forced to display @ 2048x2048... but don't know about that...