Why are new games ...

[HAL10000]

... such a pain in the butt to install?

Just bought Civ V and I can't install without creating a Steam account and all this other crap...

Hope the game is good.

[AGibbon]

I am sure the game is good, going by reviews. I do not understand why they force your hand though. You bought the boxed game as to not have to use something like steam, yet they shove it down your throat. This trend will not go away it seems.

[HAL10000]

That's the least thing annoying about the game. The fact that you have a hard time skipping the opening animation. Game doesn't like Alt-Tabbing either.

That, and the new bizarre way of transporting units across water.

Game looks good and has some interesting changes. Miss some things like the creation and spread of religion.

[sandorski]

You don't have a Steam Account?

[Pr3tty F1y]

You don't have a Steam Account?

He uses a Mac

Also, there really is no downside to having to have a Steam account.

Steam > *

[HAL10000]

Game is a disappointment. Should have known better than to buy a game for my PC. Can't alt-tab out. Can't force task manager to come up. Actually have to reboot the whole machine.

Yeah, Steam is *so* worth it. I can understand why the idea of not having discs floating around is a nice idea but meh, for the number of games I even play... Downside to Steam, yes there is (upside if you hate online cheaters I guess). In order to prevent cheating, Steam games apparently don't allow you to alt-tab and such. I thought it was just bad developer coding but apparently Civ5 isn't the first game with this "feature".

Not only that, but each time I try to run Civ5 after each forced reboot, Steam tells me it's already running. Doubleclick the icon and it starts up normally. So, given this is my first Steam experience, colour me unimpressed.

The load times kill Civ5, though. 12 minutes to load a "huge" map? Gimme a break. Maps aren't "huge" at all.

[Pr3tty F1y]

Game is a disappointment. Should have known better than to buy a game for my PC. Can't alt-tab out. Can't force task manager to come up. Actually have to reboot the whole machine.

Yeah, Steam is *so* worth it. I can understand why the idea of not having discs floating around is a nice idea but meh, for the number of games I even play...

The load times kill Civ5, though. 12 minutes to load a "huge" map? Gimme a break. Maps aren't "huge" at all.

Step 1. Scrap Mac.

Step 2. Invest in killer PC.

Step 3. Game.

Step 4. ???

Step 5. Profit.

[sandorski]

He uses a Mac

Also, there really is no downside to having to have a Steam account.

Steam > *

Ahh, I suppose a "Welcome to Gaming" is in order then.

[HAL10000]

Step 1. Scrap Mac.

No.

Step 2. Invest in killer PC.

Already have one. What did you think I was running it on? My MacMini with integrated Intel graphics?! My Mini is going into it's third year...

Step 3. Game.

Sometimes.

[Bires]

This thread almost makes me use the word "fail" as an adjective.

[genci88]

He uses a Mac

Also, there really is no downside to having to have a Steam account.

Steam > *

No Steam > Steam

Really though, if the physical version of a game I want requires Steam I simply don't buy it. On the other hand, if it comes with regular disc based protection, I go ahead and purchase it. It's that simple.

[VVanks]

LOL, I used a cracked version.

[Pr3tty F1y]

No Steam > Steam

Really though, if the physical version of a game I want requires Steam I simply don't buy it. On the other hand, if it comes with regular disc based protection, I go ahead and purchase it. It's that simple.

I'm sure your one man protest is greatly affecting Valve and it's 2.2million current active users

[genci88]

I'm sure your one man protest is greatly affecting Valve and it's 2.2million current active users

Actually, I'm part of that "2.2 million", as having a Steam account is mandatory for playing CSS. Just like many other "active users" who are forced to use Steam in order to play their store bought games.

I can hypothesise about why some of you defend Steam as if it was your first born child though. When they shove **** (or in this case Steam DRM) down your throat long enough, you start to develop Stockholm syndrome. After all, your whole game collection is held hostage by one company.

[Pr3tty F1y]

Actually, I'm part of that "2.2 million", as having a Steam account is mandatory for playing CSS. Just like many other "active users" who are forced to use Steam in order to play their store bought games.

I can hypothesise about why some of you defend Steam as if it was your first born child though. When they shove **** (or in this case Steam DRM) down your throat long enough, you start to develop Stockholm syndrome. After all, your whole game collection is held hostage by one company.

Actually, the 2.2million are those currently active (i.e., those who are logged in). It's 2.3million right now

And I find it funny as someone who leads the charge as the "PC gaming master race" is so anti digital download content systems. They _are_ PC gaming today. People don't have to defend Steam any more than they have to defend going to Best Buy or Walmart to buy a game. It's all about customer convenience.

I think it's just that most people who have had happy buying experiences with Steam don't have any reason for antagonism against it. But it's a moot point and, really, only your loss.

You can take whatever defensive stance you like and claim that there is something wrong with people who like Steam. The fact is, your opinion means very little. Steam is an established retailer. Your choice not to avoid it only affects you.

DRM is what it is and Valve's DRM system is just one of many. DRM isn't going away, but Valve's system is pretty transparent and that's what a lot of customers like.

[genci88]

Actually, the 2.2million are those currently active (i.e., those who are logged in). It's 2.3million right now

And I find it funny as someone who leads the charge as the "PC gaming master race" is so anti digital download content systems. They _are_ PC gaming today. People don't have to defend Steam any more than they have to defend going to Best Buy or Walmart to buy a game. It's all about customer convenience.

I think it's just that most people who have had happy buying experiences with Steam don't have any reason for antagonism against it. But it's a moot point and, really, only your loss.

You can take whatever defensive stance you like and claim that there is something wrong with people who like Steam. The fact is, your opinion means very little. Steam is an established retailer. Your choice not to avoid it only affects you.

DRM is what it is and Valve's DRM system is just one of many. DRM isn't going away, but Valve's system is pretty transparent and that's what a lot of customers like.

I'm not anti-DD (I simply prefer physical distribution over it). However, I am anti-DRM. And when Steam is required for physical editions, it becomes pure DRM.

How is being unable to play the game without first connecting to the internet and then downloading 1GB worth of patches right then and there "convenient?" You like to download games off Steam, and that's fine. However, they shouldn't force it on people who prefer physical editions.

But there is really no loss on my part. Right now I have the option to avoid a game that comes with Steam DRM, and buy another without it. And hey, if in the future that particular option disappears, the piracy option will still be there.

[HAL10000]

Really though, if the physical version of a game I want requires Steam I simply don't buy it.

That was what bugged me at the start. I didn't expect to have to register online before the game would even install from a physical medium. If a person bought the physical game, the game should be installable without having to go online.

I like the idea that you have a record of your purchases so I could throw away or lose the discs and still be able to reinstall and play. I've heard Steam allows for that.

[Perky McGiggles]

Firstly, this seems more fitting for the PC Gaming section. But whatever.

Secondly, welcome to 2005. Steam is a great service, and if you buy your games through Steam (or buy retail copies of Steam games) they become tied to your account. What's nice is you can download it as many times as you want (assuming the game doesn't have additional DRM attached) on multiple machines, and no longer have to worry about discs.

As for alt-tabbing. It must be specific to Civ 5. I've never had a game fail to alt-tab because of Steam.

[KAC]

I have 100 games on steam and it is actually because of steam that I have pretty much put a lid on PC piracy (at least 80% of it). Also whatever genci88 says about steam just disregard it. If you are not connected to the internet in this day and age then yes, something elsewhere is wrong with your setup.

P.S. Alt-tabbing has nothing to do with Steam.

[Galmok]

Firstly, this seems more fitting for the PC Gaming section. But whatever.

Secondly, welcome to 2005. Steam is a great service, and if you buy your games through Steam (or buy retail copies of Steam games) they become tied to your account. What's nice is you can download it as many times as you want (assuming the game doesn't have additional DRM attached) on multiple machines, and no longer have to worry about discs.

As for alt-tabbing. It must be specific to Civ 5. I've never had a game fail to alt-tab because of Steam.

And how do you sell old games you aren't playing anymore?

[Hyrax]

I dont have a top of the line pc, so i need as much resources as possible. dont want to run steam just to play it.

[sandorski]

Steam came through for me last night, big time. My DVD Drive is having issues and Fallout New Vegas refused to Install. So I open Steam, Activated my Product Code, and it Downloaded. Sure a DVD Drive is only $20 these days, but this was well after Business hours saving me Time and Money.

As far as I'm concerned, there's no downside to Steam at all. It is simply awesome.

[Perky McGiggles]

And how do you sell old games you aren't playing anymore?

You don't?

I guess you can use that as a con, but even in the days prior to Steam I never sold my games.

[Pr3tty F1y]

You don't?

I guess you can use that as a con, but even in the days prior to Steam I never sold my games.

Yah, I never end up selling my games because you never know when you want to play them later.

Plus, I'm never one to play the newest PC games until I have a PC that can handle them. By the time I would get around to selling them, they'd be worthless. Hell, the PC resale market is largely crap unless you play through a game within a few weeks of release.

Hence why Steam + Steam sales =

[Guybo]

I love Steam. I have GTR-Evo on CD and when I went to reinstall it after it'd been on my system for a year (I reinstalled Vista) I found the disks were scratched badly. But I re-installed it through Steam and it was painless!

The worst game I can remember installing was NWN1 with expansions. There are 3 expansions and when I went to install the 2nd expansion I was told by the game to uninsstall everything and reinstall the game and expansions without patches (I was patching as I went). I was pissed because it took me a while to do this and I was doing everything the way I should have and there was no way to know not to install patches as I went.

You know what though? That's the price of gaming on a PC. It's kinda like driving a big ole' V8. You love the power but whine about the gas. You could drive a straight 4 and get twice the MPG (or game on a console)