Official AMD Ryzen 5000 Series & 7000 Series Thread

[metroidfox]

Hah. That's the issue with heat caused by thermal density.. the limitation isn't going to be your cooler; hell, it might not even be the IHS. Transferring the heat from that tiny little die generating heat at the rate of the sun is going to be a tough issue.

I think Zen4 is going to show that the way we currently handle the cooling aspect of processors is ancient and needs to see innovation. Direct-to-Die from the factory will help, but that's still a band-aid solution.

I haven't heard much about the tests that were being done with water channels being cut into the substrate of the die. The closer we get to the heat source, the better cooling we'll get. If we can have an IHS on a processor that has water-channels running through the substrates down to the transistor level, and then slap a waterblock on top of that IHS.. that's the next generation of cooling if you ask me.

We don't have much further to go before we simply won't be able to cool these chips. I don't care what AMD says - hitting 90c at stock is not good for the life of a processor. Three things cause degradation .. heat, wattage, and current. If you only have one of the three, you'll likely be OK.. but as these noses get smaller, the *safe" wattage/current is dropping rapidly. There's a guy that degraded his 12900K running Y-Cruncher for a few hours with the chip at 90-95c with a ~350-375watt load. As we continue shrinking nodes, that allowable wattage is only getting smaller.

Electronic blood is one of the potential next steps in cooling.

However, I would also challenge Intel's and AMD's processor design here. They're trying to wring the most performance out of the smallest silicon area. This is one way of achieving performance.

Apple has shown there is another with the m1, and m2 series of processors, with far greater power and heat efficiency.

Of course, at some point you're going to want to chew through as much power through that silicon as well.

Saying this, even if we can cool efficiently, I'm not a fan of generating this much heat in my room.

[Nunz]

Apple's designs really aren't comparable. It's easy to be much more efficient when you don't support older instructions. Much of the issue is that Intel/AMD are so focused on older instruction support - much of that power and efficiency goes out of the window because of it.

The M1 and M2 are slow when you ask them to perform those same instructions. They're great on Apple because iOS is geared towards them, and Apple doesn't really care about backwards compatibility, but they're limited; as soon as you take them off of ARM instructions they fall flat.

[Nunz]

That big black screw on top of a piece there looked a bit like a delidder for a moment there... thought it was to twist it off but guess its just there to press the cooling block back on tightly.

Yeah, it's meant to press the new IHS on. Nice tight mount allows for the CCDs to make better contact. I usually press mine by hand with a ruler.

[Mangler]

Apple's designs really aren't comparable. It's easy to be much more efficient when you don't support older instructions. Much of the issue is that Intel/AMD are so focused on older instruction support - much of that power and efficiency goes out of the window because of it.

The M1 and M2 are slow when you ask them to perform those same instructions. They're great on Apple because iOS is geared towards them, and Apple doesn't really care about backwards compatibility, but they're limited; as soon as you take them off of ARM instructions they fall flat.

I think he was talking about the fact that the m1 SOC being a HUGE die on a small process instead of a tiny die like the intel/amd ones.

[Nunz]

I think he was talking about the fact that the m1 SOC being a HUGE die on a small process instead of a tiny die like the intel/amd ones.

Hmm.. maybe. He mentioned "far greater power and efficiency", which is mainly due to instruction set and the ARM platform that Apple moved to. I could have misunderstood though!

[Riptide]

Spreading things out more would be a possible approach to help with the heat issue. Unfortunately that would drive up costs significantly.

At some point they can't continue to kick the can down the road.

[Tyr-Sog]

Deep price cuts on the 5K series right now. Tempting being my PC is starting to show its age.
Plus my 13yo could use a PC. What better reason for daddy to build a new one lol

[metroidfox]

Hmm.. maybe. He mentioned "far greater power and efficiency", which is mainly due to instruction set and the ARM platform that Apple moved to. I could have misunderstood though!

Yeah, I was referring to low clock speeds, high die size, high memory bandwidth.

ARM is not inherently more power efficient as an architecture. An instruction set is simply an instruction set.

For every old ARM instruction set that's deprecated, its replacement has a comparable number of new instructions to support. X64 is at least kind of stable.

Qualcomm follows the same design logic Intel/AMD do, and their processors kind of suck.

[acroig]

https://www.hardwaretimes.com/amd-ry...oltage-tuning/

[Nunz]

https://www.hardwaretimes.com/amd-ry...oltage-tuning/

Same thing posted earlier. AIDA64 stability test was used

[acroig]

Duh, sorry.

[KAC]

Need to ban this guy for repost spamming…

[acroig]

Need to ban this guy for repost spamming…

I agree.

[Riptide]

https://videocardz.com/newz/msi-conf...-x670e-godlike

$480 for the cheapest MSI X670 board with PCI-E 5.0 16x support.

Feels like a ripoff.

[KAC]

Can eat my wang…

[acroig]

Feels like a ripoff.

Because it is a ripoff.

[Riptide]

We'll see what the other brands come out with but at this point I might wait until October for B650E. Not spending $400+ to get 5.0 16x slot support.

[acroig]

We'll see what the other brands come out with but at this point I might wait until October for B650E. Not spending $400+ to get 5.0 16x slot support.

Yeah, not happening. Besides, gotta see what Intel 13th gen brings to the fight.

[Riptide]

MSI and ASUS both seem like they are on the expensive side generally speaking. Worth it? Not sure about that.

B650E Tomahawk might be a more reasonably priced option. Or an X670 from a different manufacturer entirely.

Disappointed in MSI pricing easily 100-150$ over what it 'should' be IMO. Reminds me why I've never bought any of their motherboards except for B series.

[Mangler]

I wonder if the 5.0 gpu slot will even relevant during the lifespan of am5?

AFAIK, pcie 3.0 x16 isn't even fully saturated yet, so it feels like 4.0 x16 should be able to hold the fort during this gen.

[Riptide]

That's a valid point. Thing is, if I'm moving to a whole new platform, then I want the latest PCI-E support on my graphics card slot regardless. It's just a thing for me. One of my many demands.

[acroig]

I wonder if the 5.0 gpu slot will even relevant during the lifespan of am5?

Not for GPU but yes for SSD.

[bill dennison]

Not for GPU but yes for SSD.

depends on just how many GCD's they can get into RDNA 5 and 6

if am5 lasts as long as am4 it could matter

[acroig]

depends on just how many GCD's they can get into RDNA 5 and 6

if am5 lasts as long as am4 it could matter

2025 at least AMD said.

[bill dennison]

2025 at least AMD said.

2025 and beyond



https://www.pcgamer.com/amd-am5-support-thru-2025/

[Mangler]

https://www.techpowerup.com/298565/e...oling-products

Ac compatibility list from EK, looks like you need new standoffs for all of their AM4 blocks except for the classic supremacy, it just works, the only stuff that is compatible out of the box is their new/new-ish AIO units.

And it also looks like you can buy a kit for the intel-based supremacy too:

EK-CLASSIC SUPREMACY
Another legacy EK product that still packs a punch when it comes to cooling. While the Classic Supremacy AMD water block is EOL, all owners of this water block can directly migrate to Socket AM5 motherboards. The offered Classic AMD mounting kit available in the EK store can transform any Intel-based EK-Classic Supremacy CPU water block into an AM5-compatible product.

EK-Classic AM5 upgrade kit for Intel-Based Supremacy:
EK-Classic Mounting Kit - AMD

And they recommend that people just buy the AM5 version of the velocity 2, but will sell an upgrade kit.

EK-QUANTUM VELOCITY² AM4
While Velocity² water blocks are designed to be socket-specific, owners of AM4 water block versions will be offered an upgrade kit to prevent their EK-Quantum Velocity² AM4 water blocks from ending up as paperweight. The upgrade kit will come in the form of a backplate that will require the customer to remove the stock AM5 backplate. While this is not recommended and should be handled by expert users only at their own risk, it still feels like the right decision to offer customers such an option. EK will do its best to prepare a detailed guide on how the user can perform the backplate swap, minimizing the risk of damaging CPU socket pins.

Considering the slight difference in coldplate thickness between AM4 and AM5 and the need to fiddle with the CPU socket backplate, it's recommended to simply opt for the Socket AM5 version of the EK-Quantum Velocity² water block. Even AMD itself presented the AM5 socket to be long-lived (2025+), which is another argument supporting this claim. The availability of the EK-ExactMount AM4 to AM5 backplate has not yet been specified but should find itself on the EK website by the end of the month.

[Android1]

AMD Announces New Model Numbers for Future Mobile Processors

I feel that the new nomenclature is a mixed bag. While I appreciate the addition of an architecture generation digit, the model year digit could mislead buyers into thinking that they are getting a better product than they actually are.

Starting next year, AMD will move to a new model number scheme for its mobile processors and it appears that the company has decided to use the first digit to represent the model year, which should alleviate some past confusion. The second digit in the model name will represent where in the product stack the specific chip will sit and here we're potentially getting some new 6 and 8 models, although nothing guarantees that AMD will actually implement these segments into real products. The third digit represents the architecture, so a four equals Zen 4 for example.

The last digit in the model names is a new addition where AMD has sub SKUs that offer some performance advantage of the base SKU of a specific model and this digit will apparently only be represented by a 0 or a 5. Finally AMD has added a new suffix too, where C stands for Chromebook. This translates to 15-28 Watt chips that have been designed specifically for Chromebook usage. The current HX, HS and U suffix lettering will carry over, alongside the lower-case e for 9 W versions the U SKUs. AMD has also segmented it's mobile CPUs according to the chart below, to try and deliver a clearer use case for its various CPU models. The chart is pretty self explanatory, although some of the segmentation will apply to updated models of current designs, whereas others will only apply to new laptop designs. The new model numbering scheme will apply to at least 2025.

Sources: techPowerUp!, AMD

[Android1]

AMD B650E and B650 Motherboards to Be Unveiled on October 4

New midrange AMD chipsets inbound! Hopefully they will be available in motherboards sooner rather than later.

AMD's recently announced Ryzen 7000-series Socket AM5 processors are expected to go on sale from September 27, but on that day, you'll only be able to choose between the top-grade AMD X670E chipset, and the second-best X670. Although AMD announced the mid-tier B650E and B650 chipsets, they will be available from a later date. We're not getting confirmation of at least one important date—October 4, 2022. On this date, various motherboard manufacturers are expected to announce their products based on the B650E and B650, and we'll probably hear retail availability closer to that day. The table below shows the key specs differentiating the B650E/B650 from the X670E/X670. The B650E/B650 are a single-chip chipset, as opposed to the X670E/X670 being a dual-chip solution. You get fewer downstream PCIe lanes, one less 20 Gbps USB port, six less 10 Gbps ports.

Sources: techPowerUp!, VideoCardz.com

[bill dennison]

AMD Ryzen 9 7950X Can Hit Up To 5.85 GHz at Stock Only If Temps Are Below 50C, 5.1 GHz All-Core Frequency

https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-9-795...ts-of-cooling/

[acroig]

Ok, so much for that!

[Dave]

yeah even on watercooling thats not going to happen without some serious cash thrown at it.

[andino]

Same with Intel chips too though, right?

The leaks show their "Intel Thermal Velocity Boost" frequency is listed at 5.8 but their P-core Max is 5.4. The only way you'll get that with those chips is on water or custom loop. Especially with all the wattage running through them.

The more leaks that come out the more that Intel and AMD look neck and neck.

For me, it's looking like it's going to come down to Motherboard and memory costs as to which chip I go with.

EDIT: And which one does better with MSFS2020...

[bill dennison]

Ok, so much for that!

are you really going to notice 5.70 GHz boost clock vs 5.85 GHz boost clock gaming

[acroig]

Of course I am! Afterburner will tell me.

[bill dennison]

Of course I am! Afterburner will tell me.

and then you will go limp

[Nunz]

Same with Intel chips too though, right?

The leaks show their "Intel Thermal Velocity Boost" frequency is listed at 5.8 but their P-core Max is 5.4. The only way you'll get that with those chips is on water or custom loop. Especially with all the wattage running through them.

The more leaks that come out the more that Intel and AMD look neck and neck.

For me, it's looking like it's going to come down to Motherboard and memory costs as to which chip I go with.

EDIT: And which one does better with MSFS2020...

You'll get those higher boost clocks in gaming. I use TVB on my 12700K for +2 ratios. Games don't pull much wattage.. 80-100watts and I'm under 55c at all times. I get 5.3Ghz all-core under 55, 5.2 under 65.

Where it gets really wild is 5.6ghz up to 2 threads under 45c

[acroig]

and then you will go limp

You understand perfectly I see.

[acroig]

You'll get those higher boost clocks in gaming. I use TVB on my 12700K for +2 ratios. Games don't pull much wattage.. 80-100watts and I'm under 55c at all times. I get 5.3Ghz all-core under 55, 5.2 under 65.

Where it gets really wild is 5.6ghz up to 2 threads under 45c

12700K is a great bang for the buck CPU.

[KAC]

Yes 5.6 GHz whilst playing Return to Castle Wolf is going to be dope af…

[acroig]

Yes 5.6 GHz whilst playing Return to Castle Wolf is going to be dope af…

This guy gets it.