It's 2018 and still no 4k monitor with 120hz or 144hz support?

[KAC]

I honestly think there are just stupid dumb shits sitting in these companies. All they had to do was make a 32" 4K 120/138 Hz OLED and charge 1200 bucks for it. But NO, that is too much common sense to ask of these a holes!

[demo]

It's great OLED's are on the way but there's no format I really like. 27" 1440p too small in both size and res, and 45" 1440p too big for that res, but I wouldn't mind seeing one in action. Pixel pitch is the same as 55" 4k, which I find OK, so it may not be as bad as it sounds.

[Trunks0]

[KAC]

OLED monitors are still new. We will get first decent monitor by LG this year - 27 inch 1440P 240 Hz.
You can buy Alienware QD OLED widescreen right now.

There is also future 45 inch bendable OLED from Corsair and LG. Maybe ASUS also.

[Och]

So looks like there is a lot of tech in development, and I am genuinely interested in experiencing 120/144fps gaming, 10 bit color, and now I'm also interested in seeing 24fps movies without the 2:3 pulldown. But I'm thinking it makes sense to wait more for all the tech to mature, at least when most GPUs and monitors support DP 2.0 as well as HDMI 2.1, so its probably going to be at least 2 more gen cycles.

Also, what about OLED screens, are those becoming a thing?

[demo]

P.S. - The cinema mode you mentioned, does it switch the TV in a 24/48hz refresh to eliminate the pull down?

Yes that's right, depending on the brand it could have many different names though, like 24p, cinema mode, movie mode etc. Usually lower end TV's don't have this function, either.

As for monitors, if you get a 120 or 144hz display, it will not have pulldown as 24 is evenly divisible into those refresh rates.

[Och]

Jitter from 24fps is desirable by movie buffs, but I have never heard of 3:2 pull down being desirable. In the cinema there is no 3:2 pull down, nor when using movie/cinema mode on TV's. 3:2 pulldown is purely a side effect from NTSC broadcast TV. I'm wondering if terminology is getting mixed up by some of those people.

Thanks for clarifying! Sounds like there is no reason for concern then.

P.S. - The cinema mode you mentioned, does it switch the TV in a 24/48hz refresh to eliminate the pull down?

[Och]

Do you need a monitor or a TV? If you need a TV that acts like a monitor then just buy LG C2 and call it a day.

Monitor. Its just whenever i do seldom watch a movie, i tend to watch it through my computer on the monitor.

[demo]

I understand the difference between low 24fps movies are shot in, and the 3:2 pull down, but from what I am reading on various sources, the concensus is eliminating the pulldown is taking away from the cinematic experience caused by the jitter. I'm not too concerned with it as I barely even watch movies anymore.

On a side note, the 24fps is only for movies, right? What about regular TV broadcasts - news, sports, shows, etc?

Jitter from 24fps is desirable by movie buffs, but I have never heard of 3:2 pull down being desirable. In the cinema there is no 3:2 pull down, nor when using movie/cinema mode on TV's. 3:2 pulldown is purely a side effect from NTSC broadcast TV. I'm wondering if terminology is getting mixed up by some of those people.

[Trunks0]

I understand the difference between low 24fps movies are shot in, and the 3:2 pull down, but from what I am reading on various sources, the concensus is eliminating the pulldown is taking away from the cinematic experience caused by the jitter. I'm not too concerned with it as I barely even watch movies anymore.

On a side note, the 24fps is only for movies, right? What about regular TV broadcasts - news, sports, shows, etc?

If I remember right....regular HDTV tends to be broadcast at 30fps @ 60hz and sometimes 60fps @ 60hz for sports.

Do you need a monitor or a TV? If you need a TV that acts like a monitor then just buy LG C2 and call it a day.

Or a C1 if you want to save a buck.

[KAC]

Do you need a monitor or a TV? If you need a TV that acts like a monitor then just buy LG C2 and call it a day.

[Och]

Films being shot in 'cinematic 24fps' has nothing to do with pull down, they are two different things. You want to avoid pulldown. That's why TV's with a proper cinema mode play movies in a native 24hz (or multiple of 24hz).

Pulldown is a throwback from US NTSC broadcast days where TV is broadcast at 24fps @ 60hz which does not divide evenly, resulting in frames being held for 3 refreshes and then 2 refreshes, making it stutter or jitter. In PAL land (Europe, UK, Australia) video is broadcast at 25fps @ 50hz, so there is no pulldown.

I understand the difference between low 24fps movies are shot in, and the 3:2 pull down, but from what I am reading on various sources, the concensus is eliminating the pulldown is taking away from the cinematic experience caused by the jitter. I'm not too concerned with it as I barely even watch movies anymore.

On a side note, the 24fps is only for movies, right? What about regular TV broadcasts - news, sports, shows, etc?

[demo]

Films being shot in 'cinematic 24fps' has nothing to do with pull down, they are two different things. You want to avoid pulldown. That's why TV's with a proper cinema mode play movies in a native 24hz (or multiple of 24hz).

Pulldown is a throwback from US NTSC broadcast days where TV is broadcast at 24fps @ 60hz which does not divide evenly, resulting in frames being held for 3 refreshes and then 2 refreshes, making it stutter or jitter. In PAL land (Europe, UK, Australia) video is broadcast at 25fps @ 50hz, so there is no pulldown.

[Och]

There is no pulldown on 120 or 144hz monitors. It will show the same frame for 5 refreshes @ 120hz, or 6 refreshes @ 144hz.

So that's a bit of a concern, the consensus is that movies look "cinematic" with the pulldown, and thats why they are being shot at 24fps instead of 30 or 60 fps.

[demo]

I wonder what happens to 24fps movies when they are displayed on a 120 or 144hz monitors. On traditional 60hz displays they have jitter due to frame pull, but since 24 divides evenly into 120 and 144 there should be no jitter?

There is no pulldown on 120 or 144hz monitors. It will show the same frame for 5 refreshes @ 120hz, or 6 refreshes @ 144hz.

[KAC]

Never faced an issue. I have a 240 Hz monitor.
But then again I don’t watch movies on it. But I do watch tons of YouTube and it runs fine.

[Och]

I have started using DLDSR 4K and most games are pumping 120+ fps with a 4090. Which specific game are you referring to as I would like to test it out. I have always played with max graphics options.

I wonder what happens to 24fps movies when they are displayed on a 120 or 144hz monitors. On traditional 60hz displays they have jitter due to frame pull, but since 24 divides evenly into 120 and 144 there should be no jitter?

[KAC]

I have started using DLDSR 4K and most games are pumping 120+ fps with a 4090. Which specific game are you referring to as I would like to test it out. I have always played with max graphics options.

[Nagorak]

An issue to consider with 4K 120/144 Hz is it's still hard to actually run games at that resolution and frame rate. It still requires an absolute top of the line GPU in order to do it, and even then some games will not run at those frame rates maxed out.

[KAC]

Who is HU?

https://youtu.be/v2Fp_sqg4gE

[koralis]

Just bought a 55 for the living room. Specs on 42 comparable if not too large. Has a gaming mode. 120 hz. Reportedly good. Gsync and free sync too.

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/lg/42-c2-oled

[Och]

You can run 10 bit with DSC to my knowledge. Looks exactly the same. Quite a few monitors out now with 4K 144 Hz.

HU did a December update with all the known options.

Worth a watch on their channel.

Who is HU?

[KAC]

You can run 10 bit with DSC to my knowledge. Looks exactly the same. Quite a few monitors out now with 4K 144 Hz.

HU did a December update with all the known options.

Worth a watch on their channel.

[Och]

And its been exactly five years since my original post. I have forgot most of the technicalities that were originally posted, are there now good options?

I am looking for a monitor that is at least 27", preferably 32. It must be at least 4k native, must do 120 or 144hz at 4k with no compression, and better yet all that in 10 bit color, also with no compression. I understand it will require at least a 3000 series nVidia card with HDMI 2.1 support. I see that no card yet supports Display Port 2.0/2.1, they are all still DP 1.4a which doesn't have the bandwidth required to drive a monitor with my desired specs.

Looking at monitors, there are a number of them that seem to match the spec, but I'm afraid if they do some compression without announcing it in the specs.

Another thing that concerns me, I've been using Quadro cards, which only come with DP ports, and they are all still version 1.4, even the latest nvidia RTX A6000.

[demo]

Any 30 or 60fps video will behave the same way. Try watching a scene where the camera pans. It will skip frames at regular intervals.

In fact, it's no different than 30 or 60fps in a game while locked at 144hz.

[Roadhog]

I don't have a camera that records at 144fps..

No no. Do you have a video that I could play back that you yourself can see judder on? I happen to have a camera that can record at 240 fps if needed. lol

[demo]

I don't have a camera that records at 144fps..

[Roadhog]

But if adaptive sync is active, it's no longer at 144hz.

It would be at 60hz for 60fps content, etc.




144 is not evenly divisible by 30 or 60.

With 24fps content there are 6 refreshes per frame so there is no pulldown/judder.

Got a video to share that will show judder at 144hz but not 120hz?

[demo]

But if adaptive sync is active, it's no longer at 144hz.

It would be at 60hz for 60fps content, etc.

Well, I guess the lack of judder I'm seeing must be a lie.

144 is not evenly divisible by 30 or 60.

With 24fps content there are 6 refreshes per frame so there is no pulldown/judder.

[Trunks0]

good point. I've never thought about how adaptive sync would work with something like a youtube video.

[GTwannabe]

It can be pretty subtle, but unless a given video player has compensation it should be there. So if you watch 60fps content for instance on YouTube, that video will be smoother if you set your Hz to 120 or 60 than it will be if your set to 144hz.

That's not how adaptive sync panels work.

[Trunks0]

Well, I guess the lack of judder I'm seeing must be a lie.

It can be pretty subtle, but unless a given video player has compensation it should be there. So if you watch 60fps content for instance on YouTube, that video will be smoother if you set your Hz to 120 or 60 than it will be if your set to 144hz.

[Roadhog]

It doesn't sync. There is judder.

Well, I guess the lack of judder I'm seeing must be a lie.

[demo]

It doesn't sync. There is judder.

[Roadhog]

Well he's right in that there is stutter with 30 or 60fps video content at 144hz. But 120hz is good for 24, 30, and 60fps content.

No. I think that was an issue nvidia fixed over a year ago. No stuttering here at all playing back 60fps video at 144hz.

[demo]

Well he's right in that there is stutter with 30 or 60fps video content at 144hz. But 120hz is good for 24, 30, and 60fps content.

[Roadhog]

Also, why the hell are they trying to push 144hz over 120hz? What will 144hz do to all the videos that are shot at 30 or 60fps?

Nothing? Have you not watched a movie or any other content that is 24fps?

[demo]

Yes, but unless frame rate divides equally into frame rate, you get issues?

You can change your refresh rate. Leave it at 120hz if you want.

[hazindu]

What I'd really like from 2160p monitors is preset custom interpolation for common gaming resolutions like 1080p and 1440p so that you can enjoy the benefits of working with high desktop realistate, but game at a lower resolution without a huge loss is sharpness.

[Och]

Nothing? Refresh rate and framerate are two separate things.

Yes, but unless frame rate divides equally into frame rate, you get issues?