Contemplating on Win7 rig. Need advice!

[junglist1996]

After over 2 years of Q6600 (first a B3 then a G0) goodness and going thru 3 GPUs during this time (2900XT, 3870X2 & 4870X2), I’m finally contemplating on an overhaul to my Gaming Rig including: (i) Core i7; (ii) possibly R800 (hoping the rumored $600 price tag isn't true); and (iii) Win7 in the not too distant future. I haven’t been updating myself with the all of the latest developments and I’m hoping some of you guys can provide me with your suggestions/opinions regarding this new build.

CPU & mobo
With Lynnfield released, the Core i7 860 looks like a very interesting option. From what I’ve read at Anandtech, any substantial overclocking on Lynnfield probably requires overvolting due to the on-die PCIe controller. Three other things about Lynnfield are that (i) I’ll lose the triple-channel DDR3 with LGA-1156 (probably doesn’t mean much in terms of gaming performance); (ii) 6-core Gulftown won’t be a drop-in replacement on LGA-1156; and (iii) I'll not get dual x16 PCIe slots with P55. I think 6-core Gulftown will stay at the $1,000 mark for some time to come so by the time the price of these CPUs come down to a more affordable level, the X58 will probably be "obsolete" by then. Also, I intend to get the HD5870 X2 but don't intend to CrossFire another one so the loss of the 2nd x16 PCIe slot shouldn't be a big problem. Having considered the above, what CPU/mobo combo do you guys recommend if i want to hopefully o/c to somewhere near the 4GHz neighborhood?

Core i7 920 + X58
Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz $279.99
GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 LGA 1366 $278.99

or

Core i7 860 + P55?
Intel Core i7 860 Lynnfield 2.8GHz $289.99
GIGABYTE GA-P55-UD5 LGA 1156 $219.99

RAM
DDR3 1333, 1600 or something beyond? Probably going to grab 6GB (or 8GB for P55) for this build. I haven't done any in-depth research into Core i7 overclocking. Is it similar to o/cing A64? Some 3x2GB kits (for X58) that have caught my eyes include:

Crucial Ballistix 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) OOS
OCZ XMP Ready Series 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) OOS
CORSAIR DOMINATOR 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) CL7 $209.99

Perhaps recommendations for other modules?

Storage
Although I'm really tempted to get a G.Skill 256GB SSD, the $600 price tag is still prohibitively expensive for me so I'll probably keep the RAID 0 setup for another year or so.

PSU
Do you guys reckon that the 750 watt SilverStone with I think a single 12V+ 60A rail is good enough for this new rig?

Many thanks!

[junglist1996]

Having read more stuff online, I’m thinking of ordering the following at the end of this month or early next month.

• 1 x Intel Core i7 920 (2.66GHz) CPU/8M BOX D0
• 1 x GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 X58,DDR-III M/B
• 1 x Corsair Dominator TR3X6G1600C7D DDR3 1600 6G Kit (2Gx3)
• 2 x HIS ATI Radeon HD5870 1GB
• 1 x G.Skill 128GB 2.5" MLC SATA-2 SSD HDD-FM25S2S128GB
• 1 x CORSAIR PS-HX1000W CMPSU-1000HXUK 1000W 80Plus
• 1 x Windows 7 Ultimate Retail

What do you guys think?

I also have some questions which someone can hopefully answer.

• Do you think the existing 750 watt SilverStone (single 60A +12v rail) is sufficient this configuration? It seems like even the 1k watt PSU's are certified for only one 5870 but our fellow member Ristogod has a DA750 powering his 5870 CF rig.
• Is there any benefit in pairing two SSD’s in RAID 0 on the ICH10R? Or am I better off using the SSD as a standalone drive as the TRIM command may not work with RAID?
• I intend to keep the two Seagate 7200.10’s in RAID 0 as secondary storage. Should I connect the SSD to the ICH10R and use the secondary SATA controller for the 7200.10’s?
• From what I've read, ATT does not support ATI's 5000 series yet. I only use ATT to force triple buffering in D3D (no overclocking). Can I use D3DOverrider in Riva Tuner with the 5870's?
• Should I get 5870 CF or wait for the 5870 X2? The last I heard is that the X2 is supposed to be released this month but there doesn’t seem to be any concrete news on this.
• Also read about this Lucid Hydra 200 multi-GPU solution which is supposed to eliminate the need for CF and SLI. Sounds interesting on paper but I guess no one knows how well it works until we can see some real performance numbers on the final product. What do you think of this?

[{0}Salamander{0}]

The GB UD5's are good boards, can't go wrong with them.

I would think 750W would be plenty, I have a 750W PSU and a very similar setup (check my sig).

[moshpit]

The pair of HIS 5870's are a good choice. My pair should be arriving in the next few hours. I'll tell ya what I think of them when they get here

[junglist1996]

The pair of HIS 5870's are a good choice. My pair should be arriving in the next few hours. I'll tell ya what I think of them when they get here

Can you run Crossfire on the EVGA P55 mobo? Or are you going to use the 5870's in your X58 rig with the Corsair TX750? Definitely let me know about your opinion on your new graphics department.

[moshpit]

Can you run Crossfire on the EVGA P55 mobo? Or are you going to use the 5870's in your X58 rig with the Corsair TX750? Definitely let me know about your opinion on your new graphics department.

Yes, the P55 SLI board from EVGA supports Crossfire and SLI. Since I'm only doing dual card Crossfire, the 2x8 lanes won't negatively affect performance too much. My X58 rig is now serving Media Center duty.

[junglist1996]

The GB UD5's are good boards, can't go wrong with them.

I would think 750W would be plenty, I have a 750W PSU and a very similar setup (check my sig).

I think Gigabyte and Asus are about the only mobo's I'd consider these days. Had a Gigabyte P35 in the gamining rig before and running another Gigabyte P45 in the HTPC. I think they're both good boards. Had a DFI Lanparty CFX3200 for A64 with so many issues which made me wonder why would they release a mobo in that state. I even read from somewhere that the BIOS actually doesn't have enough space so that the onboard RAId can be activated w/o issues.

[moshpit]

Yup, 750 watt is plenty. I just got a Corsair TX750 and it's more then sufficient for Crossfire 5870 or GTX295. Well, I know the GTX295 part already for sure, I'll know more about the Crossfire 5870's in a few hours

[junglist1996]

It would be good news if the 750w PSU is up to the task of powering the 5870's in CF. A friend can get me full retail Window 7 Ultimate at a significant discount. Together with the savings from skipping the Corsair HX1000, I can probably get a larger SSD in there.

[moshpit]

It would be good news if the 750w PSU is up to the task of powering the 5870's in CF. A friend can get me full retail Window 7 Ultimate at a significant discount. Together with the savings from skipping the Corsair HX1000, I can probably get a larger SSD in there.

If you hold off till tonight before making any purchasing choices on power supply, I'll happily supply you with that answer. I'm on pins and needles right now waiting for the Fedex truck to arrive with my cards. You can bet there won't be any delay from the front door to my computer room from there.

Edit: Geeze, I'm like a big kid when new toys are coming

[bigmac12]

If you hold off till tonight before making any purchasing choices on power supply, I'll happily supply you with that answer. I'm on pins and needles right now waiting for the Fedex truck to arrive with my cards. You can bet there won't be any delay from the front door to my computer room from there.

Edit: Geeze, I'm like a big kid when new toys are coming

Did it come?

[moshpit]

Did it come?

Yes. I am doing initial testing now. Everything looks to be working right and performance in the first quick and dirty tests has been phenomenal.

Crossfire works, right out of the box. That's sweet.

[junglist1996]

Great news! I'm glad that you're now enjoying your new toys after an agonizing wait.

What's your impression of the 5870 CF vs. GTX295?

[-n7-]

I think s1156 is the better value option overall assuming no CF/SLI.

I'd say that if you don't do much video work, just look at the i5 750 even.

You can get an i5 setup for so cheap & they OC easier than i7 860/870.

You really don't need to spend a ton on s1156 mobos as far as i am concerned to still be able to OC very well.

I really say my screenshot sums it up better than text can.

I'm used to [CND] $300-450 CPUs & $200+ mobos, but this is with:
i5 750 (~$220 CND)
P55-UD3R (~$150)
8 GB DDR3-2000 ($215)

[moshpit]

Great news! I'm glad that you're now enjoying your new toys after an agonizing wait.

What's your impression of the 5870 CF vs. GTX295?

Well, the 5870 CF is certainly faster. I'm definately satisfied with the scaling. I'm honestly loving it, been too busy playing games to get much benchmarking done yet

[junglist1996]

I think s1156 is the better value option overall assuming no CF/SLI.

I'd say that if you don't do much video work, just look at the i5 750 even.

You can get an i5 setup for so cheap & they OC easier than i7 860/870.

You really don't need to spend a ton on s1156 mobos as far as i am concerned to still be able to OC very well.

I really say my screenshot sums it up better than text can.

I'm used to [CND] $300-450 CPUs & $200+ mobos, but this is with:
i5 750 (~$220 CND)
P55-UD3R (~$150)
8 GB DDR3-2000 ($215)

Wow, looks like an impressive overclock! I have to admit that I'm by no means an expert overclocker. After reading this article, I got the impression that 1366 is easier to overclock than 1156 and that's one of the reasons why I picked 1366. I'm also getting 5870 CF so I want to get dual x16 PCIe for the cards.

[FX-Overclocking]

Personally I'd either go i7 920 or an i5. With the i7 you get a higher end upgrade path and with the i5 you get a better deal on a very OC-able chip.

[junglist1996]

Well, the 5870 CF is certainly faster. I'm definately satisfied with the scaling. I'm honestly loving it, been too busy playing games to get much benchmarking done yet

Glad to hear that! You bought the cards to play games, not benchmark right? Now get back to your games!

[moshpit]

Glad to hear that! You bought the cards to play games, not benchmark right? Now get back to your games!

Oddly enough, while online reviews show the 5870 Crossfire not scaling well in DoW2, it feels smoother then it did on the GTX295 or the single 5870.

[junglist1996]

Personally I'd either go i7 920 or an i5. With the i7 you get a higher end upgrade path and with the i5 you get a better deal on a very OC-able chip.

Yep, 1366 would allow an upgrade path to six-core Gulftown.

But probably won't be feasible as those processors would likely hit retail at $1,000+.

[junglist1996]

Ok, checked this Antec PSU calculator which said that the proposed configuration overclocked to 3.8GHz would require a 512 watt PSU. Surprisingly, that's only marginally more than the 488 watt recommended for my existing setup with a Q6600 and 4870 X2. Also confirmed that the DA750 has 4 x PCI-E 6 pin connectors so it looks like the existing PSU is good for the new config!

After ditching the Corsair HX1000 and factoring in the discount on the o/s, I'll get the following which works out to be a bit cheaper than the previous config.

• 1 x Intel Core i7 920 (2.66GHz) CPU/8M BOX D0
• 1 x GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 X58,DDR-III M/B
• 1 x Corsair Dominator TR3X6G1600C7D DDR3 1600 6G Kit (2Gx3)
• 2 x ASUS A5870G1 EAH5870 HDMI 1GB DDR5 (with free copy of DiRT 2)
• 1 x G.Skill 256GB 2.5" Hi-Speed MLC SATA-2 SSD HDD-FM25S2S256GBT1
• 1 x Windows 7 Ultimate Retail

So no one around here use a tweaking app for their 5000 series Radeon? Any tips on how to force triple buffering other than using ATT?

[FX-Overclocking]

But probably won't be feasible as those processors would likely hit retail at $1,000+.

I do not believe that. IMHO the 1366 i9's will become the mid to high end, with the usual $300 - $1000 range. Intel knows gamers want a $300 - $400 chip that carries the i9 badge. The $1000 part should be reserved for the "Extreme" name as usual.

Really. Do you think the i9 and 1366 are only going to carry ONE $1000 chip and nothing else? No way IMO.

[junglist1996]

I do not believe that. IMHO the 1366 i9's will become the mid to high end, with the usual $300 - $1000 range. Intel knows gamers want a $300 - $400 chip that carries the i9 badge. The $1000 part should be reserved for the "Extreme" name as usual.

Really. Do you think the i9 and 1366 are only going to carry ONE $1000 chip and nothing else? No way IMO.

Ok, I guess you've got a point and $1,000 was perhaps an over-estimation. I too would love to see i9's in the $300 - $400 range but I'm under the impression that this segment would be covered by i7's on 1156 when the 920/940 EOL. Seeing that the first quad's QX6700 and Q6600 were launched at $999 and $851 respectively, I would assume that the first Gulftown's are going to be launched at around the same price range.

[-n7-]

No offense meant, but people recommend s1366 based on a theoretical upgrade to a 6 core chip are fooling themselves at this point.

Yes, one will come out, but will it be fully supported by all X58s?
-Will some need BIOS updates to run it?
-Will it not work on some at all?
-Will there be lower priced non EE editions?

I've seen way too many posts on many forums with people using their speculation about this as "reason" to buy s1366, & well, until we know for sure, it's just guessing.

That all said, if $$$ isn't an issue, an i7 920 certainly is a great way to go.
I just wouldn't be buying s1366 over s1156 due to a possible supposed future upgrade.

All one needs to do is look into the past a little to realize how buying for the supposed possible future tends to work out...


All this said, it sounds like s1366 does indeed make sense for junglist1996.

The SSD you have listed is a JMicron POS!
DO NOT GET THAT SSD!

Make sure you are getting something with a Samsung controller (at the absolute worst), but really, ideally either Indilinx or Intel-based.

The G.Skill Falcon ones are the Indilinx ones & are okay.

[junglist1996]

The SSD you have listed is a JMicron POS!
DO NOT GET THAT SSD!

Make sure you are getting something with a Samsung controller (at the absolute worst), but really, ideally either Indilinx or Intel-based.

The G.Skill Falcon ones are the Indilinx ones & are okay.

Ya, thanks for pointing that out as I mistakenly though that it's a G Skill Falcon with an Indilinx controller. I'm now requesting from the shop a quotation for:

• Intel 160GB X25-M Mainstream 2.5" MLC SATA SSD SSDSA2MH160G2C1
• OCZ 120GB Vertex Series 2.5" SATA II 64MB Cache SSD OCZSSD2-1VTX120G
• OCZ 250GB Vertex Series 2.5" SATA II 64MB Cache SSD OCZSSD2-1VTX250G

Thanks.

[junglist1996]

Just received the quotation from the shop through a friend.



All prices in Hong Kong dollars @ approximately US$1 = HK$7.8. Just disregard the Windows 7 OEM. I'm getting Ultimate Retail from another friend. A pleasant surprise is the price for the Intel X25-M. Seeing that it costs over US$600 on the Egg, I would have thought that the retail price over here would be way above the MSRP of US$440. But the price here is actually much closer to the MSRP and guess what? The Intel X25-M actually has the lowest $/GB amongst the 3 SSD's in the quotation. I think the decision has already been made for me.

Final configuration:

• 1 x Intel Core i7 920 (2.66GHz) CPU/8M BOX
• 1 x GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 X58,DDR-III M/B
• 1 x Corsair Dominator TR3X6G1600C7D DDR3 1600 6G Kit (2Gx3)
• 2 x ASUS A5870G1 EAH5870 HDMI 1GB DDR5 (with free copy of DiRT 2)
• 1 x Intel 160GB X25-M Mainstream 2.5" MLC SATA SSD SSDSA2MH160G2C1 (9.5mm)
• 1 x Windows 7 Ultimate Retail

How does that look?

Going to keep the current HSF, HDD's, DVD burner, case, PSU and other peripherals. The new parts are going to cost HK$16,688 which is about US$2,139. If there're no more changes, I'll probably get the stuff over the weekend. Only problem is that my friend who's getting the discounted Win 7 Ultimate for me was told that the O/S would only arrive in early November. Not having done anything to the Gaming Rig for about a year and having performance issues with NFS: Shift, I really want to do this upgrade ASAP...

[-n7-]

Looks solid.

IMO, The Intel drive is worth significantly more per GB than any Indlinx is, & reviews focusing on OS performance agree with me.

So if it's cheaper per GB than the Vertexes, well, it's zero contest.

For the install of 7...if you can acquire the same version as you are receiving later, then you could just install that version & activate it once you get your 6 product key (assuming within 30 days).

[junglist1996]

Looks solid.

IMO, The Intel drive is worth significantly more per GB than any Indlinx is, & reviews focusing on OS performance agree with me.

So if it's cheaper per GB than the Vertexes, well, it's zero contest.

For the install of 7...if you can acquire the same version as you are receiving later, then you could just install that version & activate it once you get your 6 product key (assuming within 30 days).

From what I've read, the X25-M's only downfall is its sequential write speed but I don't foresee myself constantly writing large amount of data on the drive. I'm really looking forward to the switch to SSD.

Good point with your Win 7 suggestion but now I gotta find someone to lend me the Win 7 DVD...

[caveman-jim]

There are plenty of people swarming around with spare bits and pieces you could borrow from, to get the Windows 7 DVD. Just SHA1 check it before you use it.

[Ristogod]

The G.Skill Falcon ones are the Indilinx ones & are okay.

I've had two Falcon's fail on me and G.Skill customer service has been mediocre at best. They don't support their customer base through the support forums very well either. Minimal at best.

Buying the Intel is obviously the best choice.

Also, I have the DA750 power supply and it has been great for me. I am currently running an OCed 920 i7 and 2 5870's in Crossfire.

[moshpit]

Looks like the Risto-man went with a Torqx after all the G.Skill pain? Good choice. I love me Torqx. Going down to pick up a second one today.

Edit: Patriot has a nice little utility you can download to run TRIM on your Torqx if it's not one of the M28 models. The regular Torqx gets a nice little boost out of it. After installing Windows 7 to it, after all the drivers and apps get installed, running the utility cleans up everything after install and can cut up to 2 or 3 seconds further from your boot time.

I'm down to a 12 second POST to Login time now. 3 seconds to shut down. THAT is fast.

[Ristogod]

Looks like the Risto-man went with a Torqx after all the G.Skill pain? Good choice. I love me Torqx. Going down to pick up a second one today.

For what purpose? Game installs seperate?

[moshpit]

For what purpose? Game installs seperate?

Honestly, not sure beyond just as a backup drive. I just love the drive so much I want a second one in case the first goes belly up. In my entire time in the PC industry, no single upgrade has had such a noticeable effect. I want to be sure that if something happens to the only one I have, I won't lose that effect.

[caveman-jim]

Hah, I bet you Raid0 those suckers this weekend.

[moshpit]

Hah, I bet you Raid0 those suckers this weekend.

I thought about it. But then TRIM wouldn't work anymore. I don't wanna give that ability up. The utility says nothing about RAID support.

[junglist1996]

There are plenty of people swarming around with spare bits and pieces you could borrow from, to get the Windows 7 DVD. Just SHA1 check it before you use it.

If possible, can you please elaborate on what you mean on that? After a couple glasses of 30 year Glenfiddich and 18 year Macallan, I can't figure out what are you talking about.

[junglist1996]

I've had two Falcon's fail on me and G.Skill customer service has been mediocre at best. They don't support their customer base through the support forums very well either. Minimal at best.

Buying the Intel is obviously the best choice.

Also, I have the DA750 power supply and it has been great for me. I am currently running an OCed 920 i7 and 2 5870's in Crossfire.

I originally considered the GSkill Falcon, which I mistakenly took as the Titan in my earlier post. In the US, you would at least get direct access (forum or 1-800) to the manufacturer. Over here, I can only deal with their local distributors which based on my limited experience don't offer any kind of useful support, and the RMA process would not be enjoyable to say the least.

Thanks for reaffirming my position regarding the PSU.

[junglist1996]

I want to be sure that if something happens to the only one I have, I won't lose that effect.

Now that's what separates the men from the boys.

[caveman-jim]

If possible, can you please elaborate on what you mean on that? After a couple glasses of 30 year Glenfiddich and 18 year Macallan, I can't figure out what are you talking about.

A vertible torrent of whisky! Pass a bit my way

[junglist1996]

Ok, I admit there was a deficiency in my brain's processing power.