Radeon 5800s to See Price Increase?

[moshpit]

According to the Italian site News4it, the Radeon 5800 series cards may see a price increase due to lack of competition. Could it be one of those few times being an early adopter pays off?

Excuse the bad translation:

News unvarnished, however, is reduced to the fact that the ATI Radeon HD5850 and 'was increased by $ 20 without batting an eyelid. The Radeon 5000 Series are the only graphics cards that support DirectX 11 and AMD are confident that customers will appreciate ', however, the superb quality' of this product, albeit with a "slight" increase in price.

Source: News4it

[Sound_Card]

Originally Posted by moshpit

According to the Italian site, News4it, the Radeon 5800 series cards may see a price increase due to lack of competition. Could it be one of those few times being an early adopter pays off?

Excuse the bad translation:

News unvarnished, however, is reduced to the fact that the ATI Radeon HD5850 and 'was increased by $ 20 without batting an eyelid. The Radeon 5000 Series are the only graphics cards that support DirectX 11 and AMD are confident that customers will appreciate ', however, the superb quality' of this product, albeit with a "slight" increase in price.

News4it

Economics. The short supply = higher price to meet demand. So yes, lack of competition to offset supply is going to indirectly increase price. When competition comes, manufacturing matures, price drops will naturally follow for various reasons. Their is already a price premium on these for being the only GPU.

[moshpit]

Makes me all the gladder to have snagged up a pair of these badboys now

[Flyordie]

*wishes he could use his BBA HD5870*

[gamekill]

Very wrong IMO. Way to go AMD. Just showing that if you could, you'd be in nVidia's position with the same general attitude. Disappointed...

[Flyordie]

Originally Posted by gamekill

Very wrong IMO. Way to go AMD. Just showing that if you could, you'd be in nVidia's position with the same general attitude. Disappointed...

Well, when your yields are sub 40%... you gotta hand pick em' all and test them. so a $20 price increase till the middle of December is fine with me.

[Hapatingjaky]

LOL $20? Who cares....

[gamekill]

Originally Posted by Flyordie

Well, when your yields are sub 40%... you gotta hand pick em' all and test them. so a $20 price increase till the middle of December is fine with me.

But what they're saying is not that this is because of the sub par yields, but because there's no competition...

[bobvodka]

Originally Posted by gamekill

Very wrong IMO. Way to go AMD. Just showing that if you could, you'd be in nVidia's position with the same general attitude. Disappointed...

Welcome to the world of business, where companies are legally required to make as much profit as they can for their shareholds, and AMD need the profit.

Its simple economics really; you charge as much as the market will take.

[Sound_Card]

Originally Posted by gamekill

But what they're saying is not that this is because of the sub par yields, but because there's no competition...

They're not selling this at a insane $600 dollars. I will tell you, I'm quite surprised to see these puppies at the prices they are right now without competition compared to what we have been shown before in graphics history.
I don't recall people blaming NV for the price of the 8800GTX. In fact, they blamed ATi for the absence of R600. And this instance is not even close to as bad as that.

[noko]

I am more worried about the lack of availability of the 5870's and 50's, doesn't matter what price they are at because your not going to make a penny if there are none to sell. Nvidia is probably laughing a little while bitting their finger nails off. ATI releases a superior product and charges less then competition previous generation, doesn't order enough 40nm wafers from TSMC allowing Nvidia to swamp TSMC 40nm production with junk chips.

[badsykes]

Oh.. i thought i made a bad deal by being an early adopter on 5850..
With the 2900xt i know i've done a wrong one..
I just replay the Clear Sky again to enjoy full detail..I consider this game with the best natural lighting/colors by now with very good interiors..The best interiors go to silent hill series..
So if AMD will raise by 20$ then in my country it will around 50$ increase...Very smart

[Skynet]

Originally Posted by noko

ATI releases a superior product and charges less then competition previous generation, doesn't order enough 40nm wafers from TSMC allowing Nvidia to swamp TSMC 40nm production with junk chips.

There is no actual information that AMD didn't order enough wafers, only rumours and speculation perpetrated by highly dubious sources.

The 57xx cards are everywhere no shortages, so that kills any truth to the rumour anyway, unless 58xx silicon is made from different wafers, which I highly doubt, unless someone has more info on this. I think there are two much more likely scenarios, or a combination. AMD underestimated the demand, and TSMC continues to have terrible yields.

Also, where is the actual AMD statement that prices are going up? Have only seen it reported by a few sites, nothing from AMD. What is certain is the 58xx cards are impossible to find right now, sucks big time.

[moshpit]

Originally Posted by Skynet

What is certain is the 58xx cards are impossible to find right now, sucks big time.

Yes, this is true. It was a PITA finding stock on 2 cards simultaneously. I actually had to buy them from Directron who I never buy from. Never trusted them. But they had good price and availability. I bought the last 2 in stock, but they restocked again the next day. That stock was gone by that evening. In 2 days time I watched them go in and out of stock every day until my pair arrived on the 3rd day.

[kn00tcn]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...ue&Order=PRICE 5870 still $10 lower than the quoted msrp before launch

& it launched at $379 right? so it's been a $10 increase from the $20 decrease

[moshpit]

Originally Posted by kn00tcn

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...ue&Order=PRICE 5870 still $10 lower than the quoted msrp before launch

& it launched at $379 right? so it's been a $10 increase from the $20 decrease

Actually, I thought they were SUPPOSED to launch at $399, though I haven't seen any models push that price.

[Flyordie]

Originally Posted by moshpit

Actually, I thought they were SUPPOSED to launch at $399, though I haven't seen any models push that price.

That was rumored, however AMD felt they could maintain a decent profit margin with $379.99 for the HD5870 and $279.99 for the HD5850.

tbh, I don't know what AMD is doing with this move....

[moshpit]

Originally Posted by Flyordie

That was rumored, however AMD felt they could maintain a decent profit margin with $379.99 for the HD5870 and $279.99 for the HD5850.

tbh, I don't know what AMD is doing with this move....

Not much, it seems

[Flyordie]

Originally Posted by moshpit

Not much, it seems

Prices of the HD5870/50 don't bother me, I got HD5770 Crossfire and 1 unused BBA HD5870 sitting in my safe... dang thing is to long to use...

[moshpit]

Originally Posted by Flyordie

Prices of the HD5870/50 don't bother me, I got HD5770 Crossfire and 1 unused BBA HD5870 sitting in my safe... dang thing is to long to use...

Ouch. I was worried about that as well. Therefore, I bought a new case, big enough to fit a few of these badboys in

[{0}Salamander{0}]

I guess its inevitable really. Intel is exactly the same with its CPUs, AMD can't really compete in terms of CPU horsepower, which results in Intel keeping the price of its i7 range high. If AMD had a CPU which had the same performance as i7 for a lower price, then you could bet Intel would lower its prices, but it doesn't.

[noko]

Looks like yield issues with the 40nm process is putting another road block up.

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20091030PD209.html

[noko]

At ZipZoomFly the 5850's have about half of them over $300, the 5870's all except one of them are over $400. Still a good deal for what one is getting. Not sure if this is just ZipZoomFly or if all sellers will be doing this. In the past NewEgg use to sell the newer video cards for over suggested retail price, anyways NewEgg has Gigabyte 5850 for $284 in stock, don't know how long that will last.

Personally I see these prices more reasonable to charge compared to what is out there, if Nvidia is successful with Fermi then ATI can then reduce the prices. Still waiting on the 2gb version of a 5870 not sure what that baby will be priced plus seeing how folks are doing with the 5870's as in any broad bad issues.

[Flyordie]

Originally Posted by noko

Looks like yield issues with the 40nm process is putting another road block up.

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20091030PD209.html

See, like I said earlier. Yields are not good enough for a worldwide launch of such a sought after product.

[noko]

This is what I find very interesting. Nvidia is green for Fermi production even with ultra low yields. This makes sense for the Tesla line where profit margin is highest. If Fermi is half what Nvidia is saying on the computing side of things which already Nvidia has shown some rather outstanding results from rendering (Vray using Cuda) to scientific type stuff. Nvidia maybe going into a market alone or more exactly take over a number of sectors that use to be done for example by render houses with hundreds of cpu's where one fermi could be faster (limited market but just one example) but overall reach can be incredible in other areas as well, server market? The main point here is nvidia maybe able to pay TSMC much higher prices per wafer, even with terrible yields then what ATI can do. Restricting ATI availablility in a nutshell. This is partial conjecture but what is happening behind the scenes is probably rather frantic.

ATI's strategy for smaller more efficient doable design is going to be tested. This left a hole for a very high end take over. Once again just thinking aloud here. When you can show, in certain scenarios, hundred of times in speedup of previous designs, you are going to make some waves. GPU computing I've seen from ATI side has taken a side line which left a hole open for what Nvidia is doing now or at least a major jump. Now Nvidia also left a rather large hole in a very large successful market and that is gaming cards. If ATI can really push out these cards really fast at good prices and satuates the market they I think can take over once and for all while tackling the GPU computing market which will be utterly huge. There are just too many things that can be faster with GPU computing, not everyting but alot. Oh where is Fussion now?

[soylent]

I don't see how this hurts end consumers.

If stores could increase prices they already would. The reason they don't is that if they increase the price they sell less product and are left with inventory piling up; if they reduce the number of cards they buy from AMD to prevent their inventory from building up some budget store that is willing to take a lower margin will buy the extra cards from AMD and undercut them.

If AMD increases the price above what the market will bear, stores will be forced to increase prices and buy less cards from AMD. AMD will have inventories pilling up.

The only situation in which AMDs actions make sense to me is one in which profit margins on the cards in retail stores is large enough that AMD can increase prices and take some of the profit retailers currently enjoy for itself.

If AMD wrote a contract with retail stores to hand out 5800's for next to nothing it wouldn't lower prices for end customers. This leaves a huge profit on the table and almost all 5800's would instantaneously be bought and resold on e-bay for whatever the market will bear.

[train2win]

lol@ bitching about a $20 increase! It's not like they are charging $600+ like team green.

[Flyordie]

I sense a new lower clocked HD5800 SKU coming up...

HD5830 clocked at 575Mhz and sold as a "EE" model with 1,440 SPs.

[moshpit]

Just as an update to this thread, indeed, prices have spiked dramatically for 58x0 series cards. The 5870 has become next to impossible to find in stock, and my particular model, the HIS 5870, is now 40 dollars more expensive if you CAN find it in stock and shipping out.

Price hikes are in full swing and may not be over yet. With 5870's now going for as much as 409.99, will it reach 450 before it quits climbing?

http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/Produc...tCode=10011217
Keep in mind after seeing the 409.99 price, that I just a week ago bought a pair of cards from that same link for 379.99 each, and stock was replenishing on a daily basis. Now, no stock, and when they come back they'll be more expensive.

[spajdr]

410 dollars would be ok in our country, but first 5870 started at 450 dollars and now its close to 500 dollars, Vapor-X is like 520 dollars. Not that it matters, nothing is at stock