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Old Jul 7, 2004, 09:25 AM   #1
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dryars
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Thumbs up Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

***Hey guys, please keep in mind that these are only scores for FarCry. Please don't blindly base your next purchase solely on these results. Remember, there are other games and programs to consider before making a purchase. That is unless all you plan on playing is FarCry, and nothing else...



I have gathered some results from various sites to show how Nvidia's Sm3.0 performance in Farcry vs. ATI Sm2.0 . I tried my best in gathering this information, but please let me know if there are any errors or omissions. Time to draw your own conclusions.

Before I start though here is a little Q/A:

Q. Why this thread?
A. The purpose of this thread is not to incite a fanboy war, but instead to show what the major sites are reporting in terms of what advantage(if any) Nvidia holds against ATI with SM3.0 and Farcry. I apologize if this looks like a another Nvidia vs. ATI thread, but please understand that it isn't. This a completely non-biased(on my part anyways) showing of results. I am simply collecting results published from existing websites.

Q. Why are you only picking resolutions of 1600x1200 and 1024x768 with AA/AF only?
A. Because it takes too much time to gather said data. Besides, these resolutions pretty much cover what 90% of the people would game at anyways. As for the AA/AF, do I really need to answer this question? You are probably wasting your money if you bought one of these cards and don't use AA/AF.

S. It doesn't matter what you claim this thread to be, it's still going to incite another fanboy debate.
A. Well if you feel that this is the case, then you are entitled to your opinion, however that is not the purpose of this thread. Please *try* not to crap this thread.

Q. This thread is pointless, why bother making something like this?
A. Again, everyone is entitled to their opinion. If you don't like it, then please move along.

Q. Why are you doing this stupid QA session on a topic that will most likely disappear after its 16th post?
A. Good question. Because I feel like it I guess... deal with it.


* has slight lead, but not by much.

Anandtech

1600x1200 -- 6800U Extreme sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

mp_airstrip 4x/8x AA/AF -- 51.8fps vs 59.40fps ATI Winner
mp_mangoriver 4x/8x AA/AF -- 49.9fps vs 55.9fps ATI Winner
Research 4x/8x AA/AF -- 50.7fps vs 49.3fps *Nvidia Winner
Training 4x/8x AA/AF -- 47.8fps vs. 48.9fps *ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/8x AA/AF -- 43.3fps vs. 38.9fps Nvidia Winner
Volcano 4x/8x AA/AF -- 50.7fps vs. 45.4fps Nvidia Winner

No 1024x768 numbers available

To summarize, for the 4x/8x tests, both cards are tied with 3 wins a piece. Also keep in mind that its a 6800UE not a 6800u that is being compared here.

Result: Tie


TechReport


1600x1200 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

Research 4x/8x AA/AF -- 50.71fps vs 52.40fps *ATI Winner
Training 4x/8x AA/AF -- 39.49fps vs. 48.24fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/8x AA/AF -- 37.75fps vs. 38.33fps *ATI Winner
Volcano 4x/8x AA/AF -- 52.74fps vs. 51.78fps *Nvidia Winner

1024x768 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

Research 4x/8x AA/AF -- 97.88fps vs 107.17fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/8x AA/AF -- 64.24fps vs. 62.25fps *Nvidia Winner
Regulator 4x/8x AA/AF -- 59.59fps vs. 53.30fps Nvidia Winner
Volcano 4x/8x AA/AF -- 102.93fps vs. 105.33fps ATI Winner

As you can see, on the surface both cards and split evenly at 1024. However at 1600, ATI wins 3/4 times.

Result: ATI Winner

FiringSquad

1600x1200 -- 6800U Extreme sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

monkeybay 4x/8x AA/AF -- 49.5fps vs. 50.6fps *ATI Winner
Research 4x/8x AA/AF -- 44.8fps vs. 51.3fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/8x AA/AF -- 42.2fps vs. 50.1fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/8x AA/AF -- 38.5fps vs. 40.4fps *ATI Winner
Volcano 4x/8x AA/AF -- 45.2fps vs. 47.8fps *ATI Winner

1024x768 -- 6800U Extreme sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

monkeybay 4x/8x AA/AF -- 84.7fps vs 85.1fps *ATI Winner
Research 4x/8x AA/AF -- 83.7fps vs. 108.4.3fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/8x AA/AF -- 80.5fps vs. 95.0fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/8x AA/AF -- 38.5fps vs. 40.4fps *ATI Winner
Volcano 4x/8x AA/AF -- 86.2fps vs 97.2fps ATI Winner

Are these numbers right?? me thinks somethings wrong here.

Result: ATI Winner

***ADDED 07/07/2004 11:04AM EST

Xbit Labs

1600x1200 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

Pier 4x/16x AA/AF -- 41.4fps vs. 49.6fps ATI Winner
Catacombs 4x/16x AA/AF -- 67.6.4fps vs. 75.9fps ATI Winner
Research 4x/16x AA/AF -- 50.9fps vs. 59.5fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/16x AA/AF -- 50.4fps vs. 60.9fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/16x AA/AF -- 40.1.5fps vs. 43.6fps *ATI Winner
Volcano 4x/16x AA/AF -- 50.8.2fps vs. 53.2fps ATI Winner

1024x768 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

Pier 4x/16x AA/AF -- 77.7fps vs. 84.6fps ATI Winner
Catacombs 4x/16x AA/AF -- 126.2fps vs. 124.1fps *Nvidia Winner
Research 4x/16x AA/AF -- 95.7fps vs. 104.6.3fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/16x AA/AF -- 105.7fps vs. 126.1fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/16x AA/AF -- 75.4fps vs. 71.2fps Nvidia Winner
Volcano 4x/16x AA/AF -- 95.3fps vs 106.3fps ATI Winner

Results are almost on par with Firingsquad, with ATI dominating.

Result: ATI Winner


***ADDED 07/07/2004 1:36AM EST


Hot Hardware

1600x1200 -- 6800GT sm3.0 vs. X800 Pro

Research 4x/16x AA/AF -- 32.26fps vs. 35.24fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/16x AA/AF -- 29.33fps vs. 35.41fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/16x AA/AF -- 26.45fps vs. 28.52fps *ATI Winner
Volcano 4x/16x AA/AF -- 33.95fps vs. 34.79fps *ATI Winner

1024x768 -- 6800GT sm3.0 vs. X800 Pro

Research 4x/16x AA/AF -- 57.45fps vs. 75.25fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/16x AA/AF -- 51.49fps vs. 60.87fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/16x AA/AF -- 46.92fps vs. 48.45fps *ATI Winner
Volcano 4x/16x AA/AF -- 60.63fps vs 70.54fps ATI Winner

Here are the results for the first GT/Pro comparison. At the end of the day, and at the highest resolutions, both cards are equally fast. Unfortunately I cannot say the same at a lower res.

Result: ATI Winner

***ADDED 08/07/2004 7:55AM EST


TomsHardware

1280x1024 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

Cooler 4x/4x AA/AF -- 54.8fps vs. 51.8fps *Nvidia Winner
Research 4x/4x AA/AF -- 64.7fps vs. 63.7fps *Nvidia Winner
Training 4x/4x AA/AF -- 60.7fps vs. 63.9fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/4x AA/AF -- 52.8fps vs. 51.9fps *Nvidia Winner
Volcano 4x/4x AA/AF -- 63.8fps vs. 63.1fps *Nvidia Winner


1024x768 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

Cooler 4x/4x AA/AF -- 78.4fps vs. 75fps *Nvidia Winner
Research 4x/4x AA/AF -- 92.7fps vs. 94.4fps *ATI Winner *FIXED*
Training 4x/4x AA/AF -- 78.3fps vs. 78.4fps *ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/4x AA/AF -- 75.9fps vs. 70.2fps Nvidia Winner
Volcano 4x/4x AA/AF -- 91.6fps vs 86.9fps Nvidia Winner

I know these results wont be popular to some extremists(and I mean that in the nicest way), but as stated first, Im here to post any and all results. Before we begin with a final analysis, here are a few things to consider:

A. For the purpose of these results, I have included the resolution of 1280x1024 in lieu of 1600x1200, as Tom's didn't use the latter.

B. Please keep in mind that 4xAF is being used here, not 8x or 16 as most of us expect.

C. I did not include the Flashlight On/Off scores that he wrote, simply because I didn't feel it provided any value. But for those who are interested, Nvidia Winner in these tests.

With all those things considered, It looks like Nvidia is the overall winner here. There are a lot of instances however, where the XT PE comes close to tying the 6800U. Love em or hate em, these are the results from Tom's Hardware.

Result: *Nvidia Winner


***ADDED 08/07/2004 12:32PM EST

ExtremeTech

1600x1200 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT

Research 4x/8x AA/AF -- 45fps vs. 50fps ATI Winner
Training 4x/8x AA/AF -- 43fps vs. 52fps ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/8x AA/AF -- 38fps vs. 38fps TIE
Volcano 4x/8x AA/AF -- 53fps vs. 58fps *ATI Winner

* No 1024x768 AA/AF results.

Results speak for themselves.

Result: ATI Winner

=====================================================

Conclusion:

Well so far, the X800XT PE looks to be beating the 6800Ultra or in some cases the Ultra Extreme. This of course is limited within the scope of FarCry. Although not shown here, the improvments of sm3.0 in the 6800 series, shows great potential, so it should be interesting what future implimentations can bring us. For now it looks like ATI doesn't require sm3.0 to maintain the performance crown... imagine if they did have it.

In anycase, more results to come.

Sorry for the mess with the results, but if someone knows how to add formatting then let me know.

I'll update/correct when I can.

EDIT:
Scores in general for Firingsquad have been corrected.
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Last edited by dryars : Jul 8, 2004 at 06:15 PM.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 10:58 AM   #2
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

awesome summation dryars
THIS is what i needed

now... would it be too much to ask for the 6800t and x800pro
ill give you mansecks...
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 11:15 AM   #3
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

No go ahead and see if you can find in stock x800xtpt..... yeah i didnt think so...
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 11:21 AM   #4
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by milan03
No go ahead and see if you can find in stock x800xtpt..... yeah i didnt think so...
It`s probably available at the same place as 6800 Ultra. And BTW have you seen a 6800 Ultra Extreme for sale?
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 11:26 AM   #5
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by milan03
No go ahead and see if you can find in stock x800xtpt..... yeah i didnt think so...
lmao -- he's gone thru all the trouble to compile these numbers to help peeps decide whether to hold out for a (arguably) better product (x800xtpe) and you bring up current product availability to attempt to belittle his work?.. nice.. but, then again, i'm sure that this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by milan03's sig
eVGA 6800 GT
has a lot to do with your hostility...

dryars.. thanks for doing the legwork!
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 11:43 AM   #6
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

thx for the post. I get tired of hoping around sites to read all the darn charts so appreciate you rounding up the data for everyone in one easy to find place.

Personally I think you did a good job of posting facts/scores w/o coming off as a FanBoy and its appreciated. As I already own an XTPE, that I'd never consider returning hehe, the scores are not that important to me but to those trying to decide on which way to go I imagine it helps cut thru some of the hype cloud that currently exists.

Simple truth is both companies chips are interesting and have Pros/Cons so its as much preference as anything. That & whether or not you want to base you buying on what it can do now or what they promise it will do later. One of the worse marketing phrases in the world is "future proof" since on can not predict the future how can any card be Future proof hehe
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 11:58 AM   #7
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by milan03
No go ahead and see if you can find in stock x800xtpt..... yeah i didnt think so...
6800 Ultra boards ain't exactly falling from the sky there Sparky.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 12:29 PM   #8
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arioch
6800 Ultra boards ain't exactly falling from the sky there Sparky.

Exactly and it was even announced like an entire month before the X800 XT PE.

Thanks for summarizing all of those charts for us man.

This is what people need to see if they want to know what to expect in terms of performance (at least in Far Cry, but it should give a good general feel overall).
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 12:37 PM   #9
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Yeah, nice assesment. Ooops, I can't see the note @AnandBleh that he was using Nvidia supplied special version Far Cry demos for testing - that pretty much explains everything about their tie, I guess...
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 12:41 PM   #10
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arioch
6800 Ultra boards ain't exactly falling from the sky there Sparky.
LOL... and not to mention the never-announced, non-existing Ultra Extreme: according to 6800-family product page of NVIDIA there's no such thing like Ultra Extreme at all.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 12:47 PM   #11
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Agreed very good job (id be giving him props even if NV won) this comparison is of the ultra high end cards that arnt in high supply right now anyone who has a problem with that should leave and take their comments with them the man did a very good job and deserves props and respect for his work.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 01:01 PM   #12
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

eVGA is holding weekly drawings for five people to have the right to buy a 6800 Ultra EE but that is the only place that I see right now to get one outside of selling your organ of choice to someone like Alienware.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 01:08 PM   #13
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

if they used the 61.71s that would of helped frames around 4-6 more fps
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 01:09 PM   #14
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snookums

now... would it be too much to ask for the 6800t and x800pro
ill give you mansecks...

Just added Hot Hardware's GT vs. Pro comparison.

No mansecks required.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 01:34 PM   #15
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scottweil4nd
if they used the 61.71s that would of helped frames around 4-6 more fps
Who?
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 02:01 PM   #16
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Cat 4.7 hahahaha

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Old Jul 7, 2004, 02:10 PM   #17
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wotan81
It`s probably available at the same place as 6800 Ultra. And BTW have you seen a 6800 Ultra Extreme for sale?

I could get the 6800U here in Norway, but i have yet to see the X800XT.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 03:15 PM   #18
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Noone is saying they are. Just overclock GT to Ultra speeds for $399.

Ggz.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 05:27 PM   #19
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

again another thanks for all the leg work involved
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 06:21 PM   #20
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Nice work :-) I like how u wrote ATi in red and Nvidia in green. thats was really good so i could easily skim throught it all.
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 09:59 PM   #21
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

dryars very nice "orgy of info" i could have told u the XT:PE was faster without all of those benchies lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by ants
Nice work :-) I like how u wrote ATi in red and Nvidia in green. thats was really good so i could easily skim throught it all.
LOL Hell yeah same here, potheads unite.....

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Old Jul 7, 2004, 10:10 PM   #22
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

So core design and speed for now beats sm 3.0... At least the first version of a sm3.0 patch for a game. Thing is sm 3.0 needs like 60 million trannies or a third the size of new gpu's. If this thing is the future it better produce more than a slight speed bump. I dont think we can afford to see our beloved chipsdesigners have to dedictae so many trannies to somehting that wont even improve image quality or ability to generate ever more realistic effects.

Kinda scares me into thinking we are about to hit a wall as to how many trannies it takes to do how much more.

My bet is that sm 3.0 will produce very significant speeds increases but only over time when we dont care about sm 2.0 and devs get a hang of the new tech. If sm 3.0 was already being maxed out you'd be seeing complaints from devs all around about ms's new shader language.

Unless someone can show me how ati can use a lot fewer trannies than nvidia in implementing sm 3.0... I think Ill wait for a die shrink and ati's answer to sm 3.0 this fall and skip the x800xt gen... not that I can buy the damn thing anyway tween the price and availability...
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Old Jul 7, 2004, 10:11 PM   #23
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

I'm sure if the tests were done with the 4.7 final drivers we would see a small boost for ATI as well

Now lets keep getting that OGL performance tuning!
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Old Jul 8, 2004, 08:56 AM   #24
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Thanks for the feedback folks, I figured a reader's digest version of the results would be preferable to loading up every site.

Anyways, does anyone have anymore sites they want me to add?
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Old Jul 8, 2004, 09:26 AM   #25
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Just one thing that tests like these don't show you is IQ. Been playing with my GF6800Ultra and it does seem to have better image quality in the games I play, Thief 3, CoD and FarCry.
Think ATi users that went ATi for IQ should take a good look at these GF6 series cards.

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Old Jul 8, 2004, 09:47 AM   #26
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Templar
Just one thing that tests like these don't show you is IQ. Been playing with my GF6800Ultra and it does seem to have better image quality in the games I play, Thief 3, CoD and FarCry.
Think ATi users that went ATi for IQ should take a good look at these GF6 series cards.

Simon
Almost every review I have read shows that the IQ between ATI and Nvidia is about even with these new cards. I just upgraded to a X800XT PE from a 9800 Pro and the IQ looks about the same to me, which is to mean it is still very good.

I can't really find a "loser" in the battle between the two companies this time although the product launch is equally pathetic even if it is due to circumstances out of their control like the supposed shortage of 1.6ns Samsung memory for the high end cards.
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Old Jul 8, 2004, 10:29 AM   #27
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

TomsHardware

1024x768 -- 6800U sm3.0 vs. X800 XT PE

Cooler 4x/4x AA/AF -- 78.4fps vs. 75fps *Nvidia Winner
Research 4x/4x AA/AF -- 92.7fps vs. 94.4fps *Nvidia Winner <---Pssst. 94.4 !< 92.7fps
Training 4x/4x AA/AF -- 78.3fps vs. 78.4fps *ATI Winner
Regulator 4x/4x AA/AF -- 75.9fps vs. 70.2fps Nvidia Winner
Volcano 4x/4x AA/AF -- 91.6fps vs 86.9fps Nvidia Winner


Thx for all the info.
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Old Jul 8, 2004, 10:46 AM   #28
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

LOL - I can't take a "professional" review seriously for Far Cry that doesn't test the latest high end cards with no higher than 4xAF and doesn't even bother to benchmark at 1600x1200.

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Old Jul 8, 2004, 10:50 AM   #29
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

So where are Toms 1600 AA/AF scores or didnt he run them since thats where the ATI x800XTPE seems to shine best? Truthfully I tend to ignore/refuse to read his reviews since they are often poorly done. Hard to believe it but his reviews have actually gotten worse not better over time.
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Old Jul 8, 2004, 10:50 AM   #30
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Default Re: Nvidia(sm3.0) vs ATI(no sm3.0) - Far Cry results from the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arioch
I can't really find a "loser" in the battle between the two companies this time although the product launch is equally pathetic even if it is due to circumstances out of their control like the supposed shortage of 1.6ns Samsung memory for the high end cards.
I agree about the cards being basically equal, except for differences in features. I would happily buy a 6800U, however I would need a new waterblock, which there aren't any currently available yet, and I don't think I could get the same price as I did for the XT ($434.94). Plus, neither card is readily available so that puts a hamper on the situation.
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