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Other Graphics Cards and 3D Technologies Discussion forum for any graphics hardware not provided by AMD/ATI. Also place to discuss 3D technologies such as 3D Stereo, PhysX and other interesting developments/rumours in the 3D industry.

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Old Dec 8, 2008, 10:38 AM   #91
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SIrPauly
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Yeah, Take 2 and EA for crying-out-loud. Sure making some in-roads with PhysX to say-the-least. Thanks for sharing, again!
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 12:03 PM   #92
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According to this post from a developer from Sacred 2 -- there may be some GPU Physics in Sacred2:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uygar Galem
And to avoid any misunderstandings, you cannot switch Physx off. The only thing you're disabling is the GPU acceleration, in other words you're telling your system that the CPU should calculate the physics, not the GPU. However, running Physx on your card should actually work
http://forum.sacredeng.ascaron-net.c...46&postcount=7

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Old Dec 8, 2008, 02:03 PM   #93
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 03:20 PM   #94
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No, I didn't see the link but did see the video in an earlier link. Thanks for sharing!
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 04:48 PM   #95
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Another article, discribing GPU PhysX effects in Mirrors Edge, with some slides from Nvidia
http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/16...dge/index.html
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 05:10 PM   #96
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Nice slides and good to see some performance aspects with the Mirror's edge. Also nice to see how impressive performance is using a GPU Physic discrete card like a 9800Gt. Thanks!
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 06:26 PM   #97
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Big interview about PhysX with Bryan Del Rizzo, NVIDIA Senior PR Manager
http://www.pcworld.com/article/15514..._2k_games.html
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 06:50 PM   #98
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Nothing gets by Zogrim and a machine finding these things, thanks!
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 07:08 PM   #99
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Quote:
On top of that, on the PC, if you're running PhysX on the GPU, it's also scalable, which is something you can't do on the CPU with competing solutions. So that means the more GPU power you have in your box, if you add a second or third card, then the amount of PhysX effects on the screen can scale up. For example, if a building blows up into 1,000 pieces and you add a second card, maybe that building blows up into 5,000 pieces.

GO: Is there a way for people to tell what that increase would be when they're weighing the cost of adding secondary or even tertiary hardware?

BDR: Think of it like SLI [Scalable Link Interface, NVIDIA technology that allows you to combine more than one GPU in a computer to increase visual performance]. You have two chips and you almost get 2X performance, or three chips and it's almost 3X performance. In the past what we've done with SLI is that you've had to have two identical GPUs inside your machine for the scaling to take effect. Mixing and matching different generations of cards doesn't work because you'd end up dumbing down to the lowest common denominator.

With PhysX in an SLI configuration, you can designate one of those cards for PhysX rendering, and one for GPU rendering if you want. Or you can actually use an older card. Say you've just upgraded to a GTX 280 and you've got a 9800 GTX sitting on your shelf. You can add that 9800 GTX back into your machine and use that as your PhysX renderer.
Flexibility and more value with Sli is very important to me when it comes to multi-GPU. It's nice to know if one does Sli they have the flexibility to find the right results for their needs. Also, having more reward with PhysX effects is certainly nice if you have more GPU's -- a nice bonus and more value moving forward.
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 08:22 PM   #100
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Thats a pure rehash of existing info, and selfcontradictory - he states it will scale up as you add hardware, then says you designate one as a physX processor...exactly as you do now, no scaling on physX performance - it doesn't split over more than one card.
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Old Dec 8, 2008, 09:09 PM   #101
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Sorry, but the credibility got shot to heck when BDR said "You have two chips and you almost get 2X performance, or three chips and it's almost 3X performance". I've yet to see SLI scale on any remotely modern game at anything near such a "near" perfect amount per chip.

This is the kind of person who, back in the day, would have sold a dual processor machine by counting the Mhz of both procs together. I hated people who did that. Still do.
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 12:39 AM   #102
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I'd say lost planet has perfect 100% scaling with SLI, there's a few more. But yeah most of the time It's really varied.
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 05:25 AM   #103
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Found some interesting) About OpenCL and CUDA)
http://channel.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=16557
Manju Hegde (former Ageia CEO) is now CUDA general manager at Nvidia)

It seems GPU PhysX will have OpenCL version soon)
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 08:10 AM   #104
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, have been discussing about something like that a while back here, although it was more about DX 11 Compute Shader than OpenCL. Under the assumption that DX 11 Compute Shader will have native interoperability with most games, which is DX based.

For not keeping PhysX as their exclusive feature could also mean that they're pretty confident that their next generation HW will be very competitive performance-wise (although OpenCL will run "seamlessly" on today's CUDA capable HW either -- according to this PR).

Ha! NGOHQ!
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 09:52 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caveman-jim View Post
Thats a pure rehash of existing info, and selfcontradictory - he states it will scale up as you add hardware, then says you designate one as a physX processor...exactly as you do now, no scaling on physX performance - it doesn't split over more than one card.

The way I did take that information is PhysX is scalable, meaning if an end-user has more PhysX hardware, the engine, if coded, may offer many more PhysX effect capabilities for the higher-end sku's than the lower-end Sku's.

So, if a gamer had Tri-Sli, one may have more PhysX effects than a single GPU. If one had a 240 core product used as a discrete PhysX GPU one may have more PhysX effects than a 128 core discrete PhysX GPU. Not taking this information as right now and in everything PhysX but eventually in some titles or engines moving forward.

It makes a lot of sense to be scalable considering the PhysX hardware may differ now and in the future. What about future nVidia hardware? Many more cores as well. Why should all PhysX owners have the same effects when some hardware may be much more powerful?
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 10:20 AM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moshpit View Post
Sorry, but the credibility got shot to heck when BDR said "You have two chips and you almost get 2X performance, or three chips and it's almost 3X performance". I've yet to see SLI scale on any remotely modern game at anything near such a "near" perfect amount per chip.

This is the kind of person who, back in the day, would have sold a dual processor machine by counting the Mhz of both procs together. I hated people who did that. Still do.
It's how some may define "almost" and usually some wiggle room with PR speak.
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 12:27 PM   #107
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Quote:
The way I did take that information is PhysX is scalable, meaning if an end-user has more PhysX hardware, the engine, if coded, may offer many more PhysX effect capabilities for the higher-end sku's than the lower-end Sku's.
Yeah, thats APEX is all about. APEX framework will add physics LOD to the engine, and APEX tools will give developers possibility to create scalable content from the start)
APEX is in development for two years, and will be done by mid 2009)
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 03:37 PM   #108
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 03:38 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SIrPauly View Post
The way I did take that information is PhysX is scalable, meaning if an end-user has more PhysX hardware, the engine, if coded, may offer many more PhysX effect capabilities for the higher-end sku's than the lower-end Sku's.

So, if a gamer had Tri-Sli, one may have more PhysX effects than a single GPU. If one had a 240 core product used as a discrete PhysX GPU one may have more PhysX effects than a 128 core discrete PhysX GPU. Not taking this information as right now and in everything PhysX but eventually in some titles or engines moving forward.

It makes a lot of sense to be scalable considering the PhysX hardware may differ now and in the future. What about future nVidia hardware? Many more cores as well. Why should all PhysX owners have the same effects when some hardware may be much more powerful?
That's a fair point. I was thinking in terms of physX scaling out from single GPU to multiples, which would be very difficult IMO (because of the lack of shared fast access storage).

But yeah, considering a physX implementation that scales out from a 96SP card to a 240SP card is a good thought.
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 07:42 PM   #110
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Here is a video of the PhysX Screensaver -- impressive screensaver over-all in case no one did see it. Worth watching!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKoXKlXl6s0
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Old Dec 9, 2008, 07:57 PM   #111
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Old Dec 11, 2008, 06:03 PM   #112
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AMD isn't changing it's position about PhysX
http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2008/12...ysx-will-die/1
crappy blah-blah, as always.. and nothing to show)
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Old Dec 11, 2008, 06:06 PM   #113
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I find the irony of blasting PhysX and death and run with open arms to Havok and it's not an open standard.
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Old Dec 11, 2008, 06:18 PM   #114
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Yeah, and it's looks funny to compare PhysX and OpenCL/DX11. PhysX - it's multiplatform physics engine, and OpenCL is a API. It's like saying that Unreal Engine will die because of DX11)

And about eye-candy PhysX - I really wanna see, how AMD will convince developers to make a two PC versions of any game - one with normal CPU physics, and one build ground-up with "real" gameplay GPU physics) Most big titles are multiplatform - and developers usually don't even optimize graphics well, or adopts controls for mouse/keyboard)
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Old Dec 11, 2008, 07:14 PM   #115
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Rise of the argonauts uses Physx
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Old Dec 11, 2008, 07:23 PM   #116
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Quote:
Rise of the argonauts
Really ?) does it install drivers, PhysX is mentioned in readme or credits, or something ?
I'll add it to title list)
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Old Dec 12, 2008, 09:55 AM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zogrim View Post
Yeah, and it's looks funny to compare PhysX and OpenCL/DX11. PhysX - it's multiplatform physics engine, and OpenCL is a API. It's like saying that Unreal Engine will die because of DX11)

And about eye-candy PhysX - I really wanna see, how AMD will convince developers to make a two PC versions of any game - one with normal CPU physics, and one build ground-up with "real" gameplay GPU physics) Most big titles are multiplatform - and developers usually don't even optimize graphics well, or adopts controls for mouse/keyboard)
Big picture - Havok is a mutli-platform physics engine (xbox, ps, as well as windows).
OpenCL gives easier access to GPU's; Dx11 brings GPGPU API (possibly OpenCL?). DirectX including physX = death of physX/havok unless it adopts one of those standards, or both (i.e. API translates into either physX or havok depending on hardware installed on system).
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Old Dec 12, 2008, 09:56 AM   #118
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http://www.gamefiend.org/2008/12/rise-of-the-argonauts/

Found this:

Quote:
but they are not really needed, as the game impresses through the good quality of the graphics provided by the Unreal Engine, and the power of PhysX which is used to calculate how to split up enemies in half.
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Old Dec 12, 2008, 10:16 AM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caveman-jim View Post
Big picture - Havok is a mutli-platform physics engine (xbox, ps, as well as windows).
OpenCL gives easier access to GPU's; Dx11 brings GPGPU API (possibly OpenCL?). DirectX including physX = death of physX/havok unless it adopts one of those standards, or both (i.e. API translates into either physX or havok depending on hardware installed on system).
Depends what DirectX 11 really brings to the GPGPU arena. Does anyone really know?
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Old Dec 12, 2008, 03:05 PM   #120
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