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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:50 PM   #31
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CurrentlyPissed
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
I've seen people land on the moon, but that doesn't mean I know how to do it.
Then perhaps you shouldn't be commenting on how well the trucks hold up to it.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:50 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
You will likely need about a 20' trailer. You might be able to get by with 18' but you won't be able to move the car much to get a good balance. The C5 should be about 16.5' in length so 20' would be the best size.

With that, I still advocate for something in the 9-11k towing capacity range as just 'enough' usually has you needing more sooner rather than later.
We're on the same page for trailer length, I've been browsing 20'. Trucks are tougher. Only the late model trucks and then only specifically equipped versions of those tow 9k. Otherwise, it'll be getting into 3/4 ton range from what I'm seeing. Not sure I want 2015 or newer yet due to cost and depreciation rates.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:59 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by CurrentlyPissed View Post
The biggest problem is these trucks are getting so light, and their tow specs keep going up. It's unsafe to tow something 10k, with a 5k truck. This is how their tow ratings have sky rocketed, they are taking weight off the truck, and allotting it towards tow capacity, which is ingenious on them. But stupid to advise a consumer it's safe.
It's not so much the weight of the truck, but the balance of the truck. Yes, you can't have something too light, but it's more of the length of the truck and the stability that determines the towing capacity. Sure, weight factors in, but it's not the only factor (nor the main one actually). Don't focus too much on the weight of the trucks.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 11:01 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by OverclockN' View Post
We're on the same page for trailer length, I've been browsing 20'. Trucks are tougher. Only the late model trucks and then only specifically equipped versions of those tow 9k. Otherwise, it'll be getting into 3/4 ton range from what I'm seeing. Not sure I want 2015 or newer yet due to cost and depreciation rates.
Unless you just like trucks (and right now, you don't ), get something older. Good trucks do hold their values after the initial depreciation but that first year or two drop is a pretty good chunk.

Not much changes over the years with trucks. The only main things you might miss out on are bluetooth and rear camera as default options.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 11:02 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by CurrentlyPissed View Post
Then perhaps you shouldn't be commenting on how well the trucks hold up to it.
How much are you towing per year?
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 11:08 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
Unless you just like trucks (and right now, you don't ), get something older. Good trucks do hold their values after the initial depreciation but that first year or two drop is a pretty good chunk.

Not much changes over the years with trucks. The only main things you might miss out on are bluetooth and rear camera as default options.
But that's the confusion. Only newer 1/2 ton trucks can tow 9,000+. The older ones can't touch that, and would have to go 3/4 ton. I'm browsing through the F150 forums and trying to get an idea of what those guys are doing, so still figuring it out.

It will be my daily driver. I don't mind getting a new(ish) one to get the features I want and be more comfortable, to a point.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 11:19 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by OverclockN' View Post
But that's the confusion. Only newer 1/2 ton trucks can tow 9,000+. The older ones can't touch that, and would have to go 3/4 ton. I'm browsing through the F150 forums and trying to get an idea of what those guys are doing, so still figuring it out.

It will be my daily driver. I don't mind getting a new(ish) one to get the features I want and be more comfortable, to a point.
Early 2010's Toyota Tundra is rated up to 10k (like a 2012). My buddy had one that towed the NASA trailer (about 9k) and it did it without a sweat. Nice interior as well.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 11:44 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
Early 2010's Toyota Tundra is rated up to 10k (like a 2012). My buddy had one that towed the NASA trailer (about 9k) and it did it without a sweat. Nice interior as well.
They hold their value incredibly well. My work colleague/friend just sold his 08 Tundra with over 100k miles for $27k to the dealer for a 2018 Tundra Platinum. I agree with you, great trucks. We took that thing to the Indy 500 five years in a row pulling a 27' camper. It had to work a bit for that, but it did it fine.

I'll take a look, but I think they are out of my preferred range. I'm still not sold on F150 or 1500 not being good enough for the job.
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Old Nov 15, 2018, 03:24 PM   #39
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Curious if you've tried any full size extended cab pickups? They've got much larger back seats than you'd expect, my 04 F150 extended cab was perfect for my dogs, tools, 6' tall adults, etc. Might be able to find an extended cab for less than a 4 door (that was the case when I was shopping Colorados anyways, and when I bought my 04).
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Old Nov 15, 2018, 06:28 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Elysian View Post
Curious if you've tried any full size extended cab pickups? They've got much larger back seats than you'd expect, my 04 F150 extended cab was perfect for my dogs, tools, 6' tall adults, etc. Might be able to find an extended cab for less than a 4 door (that was the case when I was shopping Colorados anyways, and when I bought my 04).
All the extended cab trucks I've tried have been too small (IMO) in the back. All of the Quad Cab, Supercrew, Crewmax whatever terms they use for 4 full doors have been gloriously roomy.

I haven't tried an F150, 1500, or Tundra in the extended cab sizes though. Will definitely give it a shot.
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Old Feb 22, 2019, 01:30 PM   #41
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Starting the test drives, as I'm ready to buy. Looking at a couple vehicles tomorrow. So far, here's the list of what I'm looking for. Some trucks and a couple SUV's with reasonable tow ratings since I'm still stubborn about getting a pickup truck. All around $25k or less.

2013+ F150 Ecoboost FX4
2014+ Silverado
2013+ Tundra
2014+ Durango R/T
2011+ Porsche Cayenne S

Tomorrow I'm looking at a 2013 F150 Ecoboost FX4 (4WD, crewcab, loaded) and a 2011 Porsche Cayenne S.
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Old Feb 22, 2019, 09:02 PM   #42
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Just be careful; that the 2013 isn't a limited with the factory deployable running boards. That'd be the only thing I'd really be concerned about.

$2300 each, just in parts. And guaranteed to fail within 90k.
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Old Feb 22, 2019, 09:09 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by CurrentlyPissed View Post
Just be careful; that the 2013 isn't a limited with the factory deployable running boards. That'd be the only thing I'd really be concerned about.

$2300 each, just in parts. And guaranteed to fail within 90k.
They're fixed on this particular truck, but thanks for the heads up. It's not an option I want anyway, so I'll make sure to watch for it.

Here is the exact truck.

F150 FX4 Ecoboost
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Old Feb 22, 2019, 09:35 PM   #44
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Not bad, but always hard to tell on dealer cars that are smothered in armor all. Main things to look for on that gen.

Timing chain noise (clicking noise, inconsistent rattle in valvetrain area).
Brake fluid level (master cyl known to leak, if low with good brake pads, likely cause).
Make sure sunroof operates consistently, plastic guides tend to break.
Make sure rear defrost works, known to fail and blow out rear glass.
Operate AC/Heat in all modes, temp actuators known to fail (clicking noise in dash)
Compressor isn't making noise on operation.

That's about it, plan to replace those tires soon. Destination ATs only last 25k~

It also has Sync 2, take it for what you will. It works, but it's annoying to operate.

EDIT**** Also I just noticed that car is at a "corner" lot. Keep in mind that car is 2 hairs outside powertrain warranty, that car's at that lot for a reason. Corner lots get dealer reject cars from auctions. Maybe it's not a corner lot, looks like it may be from the pictures, I could be wrong. 15 edits later.
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Old Feb 22, 2019, 10:35 PM   #45
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It's not a big deal. I didn't get a good vibe from the place when I called them today anyway. It's in the same town as the Cayenne, so I may as well check it out while I'm there since it's a bit of a drive.

Here's the Cayenne. A bit more miles than I'd really want, but if the car is solid with good records and a clean history with proven maintenance...we'll see.

2011 Cayenne S
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Old Feb 22, 2019, 11:34 PM   #46
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It's not a big deal. I didn't get a good vibe from the place when I called them today anyway. It's in the same town as the Cayenne, so I may as well check it out while I'm there since it's a bit of a drive.

Here's the Cayenne. A bit more miles than I'd really want, but if the car is solid with good records and a clean history with proven maintenance...we'll see.

2011 Cayenne S
Someone else is going to have to help you on that one, I don't know a damn thing about those.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 12:14 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by CurrentlyPissed View Post
Someone else is going to have to help you on that one, I don't know a damn thing about those.


Just adding to the thread really. I've done quite a bit of research already on the Cayenne in particular.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 02:28 AM   #48
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Don’t buy a used Cayenne. Without warranty and service contracts you will pay a lot more on it than other cars.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 07:53 AM   #49
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Don’t buy a used Cayenne. Without warranty and service contracts you will pay a lot more on it than other cars.
Of course, it's a Porsche.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 01:53 PM   #50
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It is just not about being a Porsche. A 2011 is likely to have some problems in 2019 (e.g., the ac evaporator going out or radiator fan giving way). These things will cost you more than a routine service which also would cost almost double of the next non German car you can buy. You would be better off buying a 718 cayman or something. Or even a 2016/2017 Macan under warranty.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 05:21 PM   #51
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It is just not about being a Porsche. A 2011 is likely to have some problems in 2019 (e.g., the ac evaporator going out or radiator fan giving way). These things will cost you more than a routine service which also would cost almost double of the next non German car you can buy. You would be better off buying a 718 cayman or something. Or even a 2016/2017 Macan under warranty.
You really shouldn't be giving people car buying advice. Finances don't seem to be your strong suit.

Nevermind the fact that I'm looking at Cayenne's and trucks so I have the ability to tow and you suggest a Cayman or Macan, but what you said makes no sense. You can buy TWO Cayenne's for the price of a 2016/2017 Cayenne just to have a warranty. They are double the price of what I'm looking at, which is around $25k.

The problem with this car is that it's a Porsche, that's it. Meaning...if something DOES happen to break, it'll likely cost more. That's the decision that needs to be made and the risk that's being considered.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 08:38 PM   #52
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Where did I say 2016/2017 Cayenne? Didn’t know you wanted to tow. Get an American truck for that or a Toyota truck.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 08:45 PM   #53
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Where did I say 2016/2017 Cayenne? Didn’t know you wanted to tow. Get an American truck for that or a Toyota truck.
You didn't say Cayenne, you suggested vehicles that were completely out of the scope of the thread...so I put the Cayenne back in. But obviously, you're just doing what you usually do, not reading anything and just spewing out a bunch of nonsense.

I'm aware of what my options are, which is why American trucks are listed. But you didn't see that since you're illiterate.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 09:13 PM   #54
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Drove the F150 and Cayenne S today. Some thoughts:

2011 Cayenne S (77k miles)
Car was absolutely immaculate, and couldn't find any flaws. Body was perfect, no rust, interior was perfect, etc. We played with every electronic gadget and mode the car had to offer and everything works. The car spend most of it's life down south, starting in Louisiana and making it's way up to the Midwest with 4 owners. Carfax came back clean, with all regular maintenance done on schedule and all major service intervals like the 20k Mile Check, 40k Mile Suspension/Chassis Inspection, and 40k Mile Electronics/Systems Inspection. Loved the way it drove, sounded, and felt. Car was rock solid, no noises in the interior or from the drivetrain, and ran beautifully. A little cramped compared to the XTerra, but really not an issue. Plenty of room in back for things like bins and tools for the track, hauling tires for mounting, etc. The build quality is impressive. Nothing shakes or rattles, everything feels stiff/solid. I've had a couple friends with 911's and was always amazed at how stiff the chassis, doors, and controls all felt. The Cayenne is no exception.

It's exactly what I want as an alternative to a truck. Only downside to this is if something goes wrong, it could be expensive. The 2nd gen redesign fixed pretty much all of the issues of the first generation. After scouring forums like Pelican and Rennlist, the only things that stand out are Variocam bolts that can shear (this is now a recall, so not a big deal), possible coolant pipe problem, and some transfer cases here and there. if i decide to go this route, I wouldn't buy it without a pre-purchase inspection first just to double check the state of things as is currently.

2013 F150 FX4 Ecoboost (60k miles)
First off, it's freakin enormous. It was the biggest model, the SuperCrew. This wasn't a bad thing initially. I LOVE how much room there is. Super comfortable driving, had all the options, and a crazy amount of space for rear passengers even with a 6ft driver. I mean, with my front seat position, I could get in back and my knees were still easily more than a foot from the seat back. This also means lots of room inside for tools and stacking tires. Ride quality was comfortable, not harsh at all. It was insanely smooth and quiet, so much so that we couldn't tell the engine was even running when you were going slow or stopped. We tested it to see if it was shutting off the engine and it wasn't.

Unlike the Cayenne, I do have lots of negatives for this truck. I HATE how it drives. Yeah, it's a truck...that's fine and I understand it will drive like one. But, when I'm deciding between two types of vehicles I want to live with daily, it's a factor. The steering is crazy loose and sloppy/slow to react, it wallows about in turns, etc. Unlike the Porsche, the build quality/feel was terrible. Everything was hard plastic, the interior shook and creaked all over, the body of the car vibrated/shook when you closed the doors (due to the aluminum and no reinforcement, think like the Corvette joke where you can push in the rear bumper...on the truck, I could push the door panels in with my fingertip), and I could even feel the windshield wipers running through the gas and braked pedals. I'm confident all of it will last a while, as there are plenty of trucks with lots of mileage out there, but these are just some notes on what I experienced. Also, it was ungainly huge as in high/long/wide. I know this is a thing you get use to over time, but I don't care for huge vehicles. Also, as expected the MPG was terrible. We were getting 12.7mpg cruising in town. This was the bigger 3.5L version of the Ecoboost with 3.73 gears, so yeah...part of is being geared down for towing...but still.



--------------------------------------------------
Anyway, this kind of sealed in that I really would prefer an SUV for the most part. I'll have to really make a decision on what I want to do, since there is a tradeoff. Buy something I'd actually enjoy driving 98% of the time, or get something I don't enjoy driving nearly as much so that I can get better towing. When honestly, the SUV's I've picked so far should be able to handle the load anyway within reason. Is the Cayenne S the best choice for that? That's the choice. If I decide to take that risk, I'll likely set aside a fund to be prepared "just in case". The problem is I'll likely only be towing 6-10 times per year for now, so what do I want to drive the rest of the time? Lots to think about.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 09:33 PM   #55
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Is a 2012 TBSS out of the question? I'm actually surprised, given your history it's not an option.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 09:40 PM   #56
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Is a 2012 TBSS out of the question? I'm actually surprised, given your history it's not an option.
Anything is on the table for a look if it can tow 7k+. Will check it out from there. A couple of things on the Trailblazer though, since I thought I had googled them when narrowing down the above list. I've looked at TrailBlazer's, Tahoe's, and Cherokee SRT8's. I thought they couldn't tow over 5800lbs, and I didn't think they made them that long?

I just checked autotrader and there is nothing after 2009, and Wikipedia talks about Holden models for 2012...but nothing stateside. If I'm wrong on the tow rating, I definitely don't want a 2009 and prior. Don't care for how it looks and the interior is awful.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 09:50 PM   #57
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Anything is on the table for a look if it can tow 7k+. Will check it out from there. A couple of things on the Trailblazer though, since I thought I had googled them when narrowing down the above list. I've looked at TrailBlazer's, Tahoe's, and Cherokee SRT8's. I thought they couldn't tow over 5800lbs, and I didn't think they made them that long?

I just checked autotrader and there is nothing after 2009, and Wikipedia talks about Holden models for 2012...but nothing stateside. If I'm wrong on the tow rating, I definitely don't want a 2009 and prior. Don't care for how it looks and the interior is awful.
I didn't think the Cayenne could tow that much, I thought you were going in a different direction.

Grand Cherokees can tow pretty well, and there is a Diesel option, and V8 that has 400HP. Not SRT8 level, but it's still pretty decent. Personally I think they look great too.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 10:13 PM   #58
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I didn't think the Cayenne could tow that much, I thought you were going in a different direction.

Grand Cherokees can tow pretty well, and there is a Diesel option, and V8 that has 400HP. Not SRT8 level, but it's still pretty decent. Personally I think they look great too.
The Cayenne tows 7800. The Grand Cherokee is only 6400 if you get the R/T. The 2014+ Grand Cherokee was on my list, but they just can't tow very much. However, that's why I added the Durango R/T. It tows 7400 and has the same interior design, just adding a 3rd row. Still need to take one for a spin.
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Old Feb 23, 2019, 11:34 PM   #59
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I'm genuinely impressed the cayenne can tow that.

What about the Toureg, it's just a different bodied Cayenne.
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Old Feb 24, 2019, 01:05 AM   #60
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Haven't really looked into the Toureg, they are quite different. They use different powertrains and have different interior design/materials. I think I've read that the Cayenne/Toureg share the same transfer case (the one issue the Cayenne has ), but that's about it that I've seen. A close friend of mine's parents had the V10 Toureg and had a lot of issues with it, so I dismissed it based on that. But...haven't really done any solid research on reliability.
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