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Old Nov 11, 2018, 10:19 PM   #1
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OverclockN'
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Default XTerra Replacement

Got into an accident with the XTerra this weekend, and now it's looking even worse than it did already. Got nailed front and rear, adding to the damage from the deer early this year and the hail damage last year that made the car about 80% totaled. After getting hit front and rear (under 20mph), I'm definitely ready to get rid of it. I'm going to keep driving it until spring (goal is to purchase in May), but starting to seriously research.

I have two different mindsets on what to get. One, a nice and somewhat sporty sedan. If I go that route, I'd likely keep the XTerra as a poor weather car, light tow duty, etc. Two, sell the XTerra and pick up an actual truck. The budget is $25k. No idea what the XTerra is worth at this point, so I'm not figuring it into the equation. I'd suspect $3k-$5k.

I REALLY want a 2009+ CTS-V, but they've been holding value at $30k+ for years now. Can't really think of any other fun sedans, but I'm open to some thoughts.

For the truck, I'm looking at models that are 2014+. Chevy Colorado, Silverado 1500, and Ford F150. The truck needs to have 4 doors, 4wd, and tow comfortably 7000lbs+(my actual tow weight will likely be about 5000lbs). I like the idea of the Colorado since it's smaller, but obviously the Silverado or F150 would be better tow rigs. I hate the idea of owning a truck (which is why the cars are mentioned above) and am trying to avoid it, but this is the route to go if I want to tow a car. The SUV's for towing are just too expensive or I don't trust reliability (Cayenne).

Looking to kick around ideas on a sporty sedan or hear from anyone with experience in the trucks I mentioned. Open to other comments/thoughts/harassment as well.
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Old Nov 11, 2018, 11:00 PM   #2
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Cadillac ATS or Buick Regal GS?
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 08:15 AM   #3
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You already know my thoughts.. If you are going to get a truck, get something that can tow 9k-11k.

Also, are you looking at an aluminum trailer? If not, you'll be over 5000 lbs with your car, trailer, any tools and any extra wheels/tires.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 08:17 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
You already know my thoughts.. If you are going to get a truck, get something that can tow 9k-11k.

Also, are you looking at an aluminum trailer? If not, you'll be over 5000 lbs with your car, trailer, any tools and any extra wheels/tires.
Yes. Aluminum trailer only, IE: Aluma, Featherlight, etc.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 08:42 AM   #5
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Those are some big bucks... IMO (and it's just my opinion), that money is better spent on a better truck.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 09:03 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by GTwannabe View Post
Cadillac ATS or Buick Regal GS?
Definitely no on the Regal. I do like the ATS after spending quite a bit of time in one. I have a friend that just traded his in this weekend that he had for a couple years. It was a nice car, though the capacitive touch controls were a little annoying. Drove very well though.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 10:10 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by OverclockN' View Post
Got into an accident with the XTerra this weekend, and now it's looking even worse than it did already. Got nailed front and rear, adding to the damage from the deer early this year and the hail damage last year that made the car about 80% totaled. After getting hit front and rear (under 20mph), I'm definitely ready to get rid of it. I'm going to keep driving it until spring (goal is to purchase in May), but starting to seriously research.

I have two different mindsets on what to get. One, a nice and somewhat sporty sedan. If I go that route, I'd likely keep the XTerra as a poor weather car, light tow duty, etc. Two, sell the XTerra and pick up an actual truck. The budget is $25k. No idea what the XTerra is worth at this point, so I'm not figuring it into the equation. I'd suspect $3k-$5k.

I REALLY want a 2009+ CTS-V, but they've been holding value at $30k+ for years now. Can't really think of any other fun sedans, but I'm open to some thoughts.

For the truck, I'm looking at models that are 2014+. Chevy Colorado, Silverado 1500, and Ford F150. The truck needs to have 4 doors, 4wd, and tow comfortably 7000lbs+(my actual tow weight will likely be about 5000lbs). I like the idea of the Colorado since it's smaller, but obviously the Silverado or F150 would be better tow rigs. I hate the idea of owning a truck (which is why the cars are mentioned above) and am trying to avoid it, but this is the route to go if I want to tow a car. The SUV's for towing are just too expensive or I don't trust reliability (Cayenne).

Looking to kick around ideas on a sporty sedan or hear from anyone with experience in the trucks I mentioned. Open to other comments/thoughts/harassment as well.
Colorado can handle what you need, but I would probably look at a Silverado/Sierra. It's better to have more capacity than needed in this instance.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 10:12 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Elysian View Post
Colorado can handle what you need, but I would probably look at a Silverado/Sierra. It's better to have more capacity than needed in this instance.
Have you done any towing yet in your Colorado?
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 10:17 AM   #9
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Have you done any towing yet in your Colorado?
Only that load of decomposed granite, which felt like nothing, but I couldn't imagine pulling a car with it after pulling my E30 down from Dallas behind my F150. Some people tow pretty decent sized RVs with the Colorado/Canyons though.

Also, don't believe the official fuel economy ratings, Colorados don't do much better than 21 if you baby it, and 18 if you drive like I do
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 10:20 AM   #10
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Only that load of decomposed granite, which felt like nothing, but I couldn't imagine pulling a car with it after pulling my E30 down from Dallas behind my F150. Some people tow pretty decent sized RVs with the Colorado/Canyons though.
Yeah, I've spent some time going through the Colorado forums and reading reviews. Seems there are a ton of folks pulling around 6000lb campers, but not so many pulling cars. Couldn't really find much there besides a review or two that tested it that way and said it did well.

Surely it gets better MPG than that. I get that in the XTerra. Sounds like a heavy foot!
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 10:23 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by OverclockN' View Post
Yeah, I've spent some time going through the Colorado forums and reading reviews. Seems there are a ton of folks pulling around 6000lb campers, but not so many pulling cars. Couldn't really find much there besides a review or two that tested it that way and said it did well.

Surely it gets better MPG than that. I get that in the XTerra. Sounds like a heavy foot!
I've never gotten better than 20 on a full tank, doing all highway. Plenty of people on the forums get similar mileage, seems inconsistent.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 10:46 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
Those are some big bucks... IMO (and it's just my opinion), that money is better spent on a better truck.
Just depends on what I decide to get. I can't stand big trucks. It's looking like I'll likely go that direction, but if I do get something smaller...that's where the light trailer comes in.

Only issue that bugs me with towing is how it makes all the little stuff more complicated. Following my buddies to the track while they're hitting 75-80mph. Where we stop and stay overnight. There's lots of little stuff that just makes traveling a bit more complicated. I'd prefer not to have the hassle. The flip side is riding in an uncomfortable car, driving it arguably hard on the track (breakdowns), and being limited on tire life and choices. It would also be nice to start towing the yellow Z to 1/2 mile events with extra tires. I'm fed up with dodging rain and having tire problems causing me to lose an entire $600 weekend.

Lots to think about...
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 11:12 AM   #13
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It definitely complicates things... You have to figure out where you are going park... Using tiny gas stations is not really an option most of the time... Have to deal with where you are going to store it (if no HOA, them it's not a problem)... etc...

Yea, a trailer does complicate things for sure. However to your point, it makes life easier in other areas.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 11:22 AM   #14
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Yea, a trailer does complicate things for sure. However to your point, it makes life easier in other areas.
Im somewhat hoping I'll discover a very cool sporty car I haven't thought of yet that I simply can't life without. Enough to buy that instead and just build a tire trailer for the C5's. Won't make the track car any more comfortable or make me want to drive it to say Sebring like I did the BRZ, but it solves the storage and tire problems.

The only thing that really does it for me is the CTS-V at the moment.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 11:46 AM   #15
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Enough to buy that instead and just build a tire trailer for the C5's. Won't make the track car any more comfortable or make me want to drive it to say Sebring like I did the BRZ, but it solves the storage and tire problems.
Just keep in that mind that if you have some other mechanical failure, you'll be stuck going the tire dolly route. I did have my clutch destroy itself at RPM once. Granted, I needed a few people to help push the car onto the trailer since I don't have a winch but I was still able to get home.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 12:08 PM   #16
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Just keep in that mind that if you have some other mechanical failure, you'll be stuck going the tire dolly route.
I'm not following you. Im thinking of using a 2wheel push cart for pushing around tires, but cant think of how it's relevant.
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 12:13 PM   #17
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I'm not following you. Im thinking of using a 2wheel push cart for pushing around tires, but cant think of how it's relevant.
If you go with a tire trailer rather than a full vehicle trailer, you will still be susceptible to being stranded at a track (whether road course or drag).
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Old Nov 12, 2018, 12:40 PM   #18
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If you go with a tire trailer rather than a full vehicle trailer, you will still be susceptible to being stranded at a track (whether road course or drag).
Gotcha. Yes, that's definitely been a concern.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 08:34 PM   #19
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You already know my thoughts.. If you are going to get a truck, get something that can tow 9k-11k.

Also, are you looking at an aluminum trailer? If not, you'll be over 5000 lbs with your car, trailer, any tools and any extra wheels/tires.
2015+ F150 can tow 12,200 per spec sheet.


I don't suggest it though.

If you are towing 7k, you need to get into a half ton, minimum. Take it from professional experience. I've seen countless guys buy an F150 because it can tow 12k, and come in bitching, and whining about how poor it does anything even close to 10k, in all aspects. Braking, accelerating, economy, wear, etc. It's just not smart to tow something twice the weight of the truck. Physics and all. An F150, 1500, can tow 7k yes. But you will wear down the truck doing it as often as you would. You will be unhappy with the truck, you will regret the decision. Trust me.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 09:38 PM   #20
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2015+ F150 can tow 12,200 per spec sheet.


I don't suggest it though.

If you are towing 7k, you need to get into a half ton, minimum. Take it from professional experience. I've seen countless guys buy an F150 because it can tow 12k, and come in bitching, and whining about how poor it does anything even close to 10k, in all aspects. Braking, accelerating, economy, wear, etc. It's just not smart to tow something twice the weight of the truck. Physics and all. An F150, 1500, can tow 7k yes. But you will wear down the truck doing it as often as you would. You will be unhappy with the truck, you will regret the decision. Trust me.
Huh? An F150 and 1500 ARE 1/2 ton pickups. I won't be towing 7k, I'll be towing 5k if it's an aluminum trailer and 5,500-6,000 if it's a heavier steel trailer (the ones I've looked at put me closer to 5,500). And then you're talking about pulling 10k and 12k pounds.

Mahjik makes a lot of sense, and usually does. I respect his opinion as he has a lot of experience in the stuff I'm doing, which is why I'm putting more consideration into a larger truck (bigger than Colorado). But you're absolutely nuts if you think you're going to convince me I need anything larger than a late model F150 or 1500 to tow an open trailer and 3,100lb car, assuming the truck has the obvious other necessary equipment (tow package, correct gearing, etc). It's possible I misunderstood, and you're saying buy an F150 or 1500 and not the smaller Colorado. It seemed like you were saying F150 isn't enough.

Have you towed cars with an F150 or 1500?
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:01 PM   #21
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Quote:
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Huh? An F150 and 1500 ARE 1/2 ton pickups. I won't be towing 7k, I'll be towing 5k if it's an aluminum trailer and 5,500-6,000 if it's a heavier steel trailer (the ones I've looked at put me closer to 5,500). And then you're talking about pulling 10k and 12k pounds.

Mahjik makes a lot of sense, and usually does. I respect his opinion as he has a lot of experience in the stuff I'm doing, which is why I'm putting more consideration into a larger truck. But you're absolutely nuts if you think you're going to convince me I need anything larger than a late model F150 or 1500 to tow an open trailer and 3,100lb car, assuming the truck has the obvious other necessary equipment (tow package, correct gearing, etc). It's possible I misunderstood, and you're saying buy an F150 or 1500 and not the smaller Colorado. It seemed like you were saying F150 isn't enough.

Have you towed cars with an F150 or 1500?
You said 7k .

And I never said they couldn't. In fact, I clearly said they could. Doesn't mean they should often. Yes, I meant 3/4 ton. You can go with a F150, or 1500, and tow 7k all you want. They are capable. I was making the joke about the 12,200 spec for the F150. It's silly. Towing 12k with an F150 is just stupid, the fact that it's even speced that way is stupid.

I'm just saying, you will see quite a bit of wear on pads, warp the rotors, chop the tires, fail suspension, etc. If you get the 2.7, or 3.5, expect those chains to stretch around 100k, and likely pop the engine. You go to the track often, you will be towing often. I don't think a 1/2 ton is a good choice, personally, and professionally. I think you are limiting yourself to what you can tow with a 1/2. But you're right, I wouldn't know. Mahjik sees the trucks out there doing it, I only see what people come in and complain what fails on them.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:05 PM   #22
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You said 7k .

And I never said they couldn't. In fact, I clearly said they could. Doesn't mean they should often. Yes, I meant 3/4 ton. You can go with a F150, or 1500, and tow 7k all you want. They are capable. I was making the joke about the 12,200 spec for the F150. It's silly. Towing 12k with an F150 is just stupid, the fact that it's even speced that way is stupid.

I'm just saying, you will see quite a bit of wear on pads, warp the rotors, chop the tires, fail suspension, etc. If you get the 2.7, or 3.5, expect those chains to stretch around 100k, and likely pop the engine. You go to the track often, you will be towing often. I don't think a 1/2 ton is a good choice, personally, and professionally. I think you are limiting yourself to what you can tow with a 1/2. But you're right, I wouldn't know. Mahjik sees the trucks out there doing it, I only see what people come in and complain what fails on them.
I did not say I'd tow 7,000, I said I'd be towing 5,000. I was giving myself some overhead. In other words, I'm not going to buying a vehicle rated for 5000 and expect tow that same weight with it.

Quote:
tow comfortably 7000lbs+(my actual tow weight will likely be about 5000lbs)
If it turns out that I "NEED" a 3/4 ton truck to pull my car, I simply won't be buying a truck. That'll be the end of it. Will have to do more research.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:12 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by OverclockN' View Post
I did not say I'd tow 7,000, I said I'd be towing 5,000. I was giving myself some overhead. In other words, I'm not going to buying a vehicle rated for 5000 and expect tow that same weight with it.
If you are towing 5k, fine. But before you plump down on a truck (more so buying new for 40-50k) ask yourself if thats the most trailer you will ever buy. Will you ever tow material with it? What more will you want out of this truck?

If you feel you will be towing closer to 7k, realistically. I think you need to move up into 3/4 ton.

Don't take my word for it, just go to the local dealers around you and talk with the techs. It's so often we get people coming in because they need pads, and rotors on their 60k F150 at 15000 miles, their tires are chopped to **** at 10k miles, etc.

Their is a spec war going on with 1/2 ton. Who can put up the biggest, baddest numbers, every year. The trucks are not taking it well. I can't tell you how many times I've heard one of our diesel techs walk off joking saying should've bought a 250 after hearing a customer complaint about xyz.

I just cought your update, again. I never said you need to. I'm simply saying I think you will be unhappy with it. I hand to god, seen this every day at FORD. I won't lie, I was caught up in it too. When I first went to FORD my dad was wanting to get rid of his ECODiesel Ram 1500, to tow his enclosed race trailer. Knowing these bad-ass F150s in 2015 were sprouting a 12,200 tow capacity I went up to a salesmen. Thinking I'm bad-ass. Hey Mr. Salesmen my dads looking for a new truck I've been telling him about the new F150, he's interested.

Mr. Salesmen literally did not even want to sell my dad the truck after I told him what he wanted it for. Told me straight to my face, he needs a 250. And I proceeded to see it, every day in the shop.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:20 PM   #24
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I fully expect to have additional wear and tear on brake pads and rotors. Even if they needed to be replaced every 15k miles, that's likely 2 years of driving for me. I'm not worried in the least bit about those kind of cheap consumable costs.

However, what I am worried about, is towing safely. I'm failing to see any real safety issues. I see no way I'll ever want an enclosed trailer or bigger truck in the next 3-5 years. After that time, if I decide I want to upgrade, I'll simply go out and buy a different truck.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:25 PM   #25
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No offense, but I don't think CurrentlyPissed has a lot of experience with actual car hauler trailers.

Even on an undersized truck, you don't wear down brakes and such. The trailer will have brakes. Towing puts stress on the vehicle regardless of the vehicle. The length of the truck and the power helps with stability and being able to get out of people's way on the highway but you can get around those easily if you don't have them. Stability bars go a LONG way.

Transmissions are more of a concern with towing. If the vehicle doesn't come with a transmission cooler (or has a small one), adding one or an additional larger one is key for towing. A trailer hitch with stability bars and rear air bags are also a must. I can't count how many large trucks I see driving around with the rear sagging while towing or carrying a heavy rear payload. Sure they have the power, but the owner didn't set it up properly for the tasks.

My FJ is rated around 5000 lbs for towing (depending on which website you read). The wheelbase is just too short. I'm over that for sure with all my gear loaded. Stability wise, it's awesome (I have a hitch with stability bars). I'm not going through brake pads. My trailer brakes just fine. I'm not warping rotors (and rotor warping in a myth). It does put stress on my suspension but I have rear air bags which helps a ton. I do notice my suspension gets out of alignment quicker when I tow often than when I don't which is to be expected. I do also have a large transmission cooler as well.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:34 PM   #26
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Definitely expected to look at trans cooling, as I think we've talked about that briefly before. Not sure on the bags yet, but it's something I'll have to look at when I find the truck and start trying to figure out proper tongue weights and loading the trailer properly. I'll check with my friends that haul the Vipers too, since they both had open trailers. One of them had a huge newer Dodge PowerWagon, but the other looked like a normal Ram that was a few years old and they both pulled fine at 70mph to Road America.

I'm willing to step up to a bigger F150 size truck (1/2 ton), but no bigger than that. Will just get a cheap SUV to replace the XTerra (still need a larger vehicle to tow the bike and haul car parts/tires) and use a small tire trailer on the C5's at that point.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:39 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
No offense, but I don't think CurrentlyPissed has a lot of experience with actual car hauler trailers.

Even on an undersized truck, you don't wear down brakes and such. The trailer will have brakes. Towing puts stress on the vehicle regardless of the vehicle. The length of the truck and the power helps with stability and being able to get out of people's way on the highway but you can get around those easily if you don't have them. Stability bars go a LONG way.

Transmissions are more of a concern with towing. If the vehicle doesn't come with a transmission cooler (or has a small one), adding one or an additional larger one is key for towing. A trailer hitch with stability bars and rear air bags are also a must. I can't count how many large trucks I see driving around with the rear sagging while towing or carrying a heavy rear payload. Sure they have the power, but the owner didn't set it up properly for the tasks.

My FJ is rated around 5000 lbs for towing (depending on which website you read). The wheelbase is just too short. I'm over that for sure with all my gear loaded. Stability wise, it's awesome (I have a hitch with stability bars). I'm not going through brake pads. My trailer brakes just fine. I'm not warping rotors (and rotor warping in a myth). It does put stress on my suspension but I have rear air bags which helps a ton. I do notice my suspension gets out of alignment quicker when I tow often than when I don't which is to be expected. I do also have a large transmission cooler as well.
I'd be willing to bet I've seen more goosenecks than you have . Anything can tow anything. Hell we use a 2003 Mitsubishi Lancer to tow things into the shop.

You _will_ wear down the brakes on an F150, you will induce severe wear on the vehicle towing. Trailer brakes or not. You will not ever tell me otherwise, because I literally seen it every other day. The F150 has severe undersized braking for what it's capable. Beleive it or not however. The new 10 speed trans is pretty much rock-solid. But thats what you get when GM and Ford co-design a billion dollar R&D for it. We see pretty much everything else fail around it. I'd say it's very well likely the strongest point on the truck. Shockingly enough.

Also, new trucks are lighter than ever, and that's not a good thing for towing.

You should know the cardinal rule of towing. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:42 PM   #28
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You will likely need about a 20' trailer. You might be able to get by with 18' but you won't be able to move the car much to get a good balance. The C5 should be about 16.5' in length so 20' would be the best size.

With that, I still advocate for something in the 9-11k towing capacity range as just 'enough' usually has you needing more sooner rather than later.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:43 PM   #29
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I'd be willing to bet I've seen more goosenecks than you have
I've seen people land on the moon, but that doesn't mean I know how to do it.
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Old Nov 13, 2018, 10:48 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Mahjik View Post
You will likely need about a 20' trailer. You might be able to get by with 18' but you won't be able to move the car much to get a good balance. The C5 should be about 16.5' in length so 20' would be the best size.

With that, I still advocate for something in the 9-11k towing capacity range as just 'enough' usually has you needing more sooner rather than later.
The biggest problem is these trucks are getting so light, and their tow specs keep going up. It's unsafe to tow something 10k, with a 5k truck. This is how their tow ratings have sky rocketed, they are taking weight off the truck, and allotting it towards tow capacity, which is ingenious on them. But stupid to advise a consumer it's safe.
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