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Old Jan 19, 2021, 03:59 PM   #1
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Lazy8s
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Default CPU/Mobo/Ram upgrade question

My coworker has a 3080 already, components above are ~6 years old.

He's looking to spend ~$1500 and is asking me intel or AMD is better for MS Flightsim and video editing and...I don't know lol. I did question his PSU as it's an EVGA 750w - I don't know the model.

He's also asking for an AIO cooling recommendation. Likeliest place to buy is Micro Center.

Thanks for the help guys.
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Old Jan 19, 2021, 04:28 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy8s View Post
My coworker has a 3080 already, components above are ~6 years old.

He's looking to spend ~$1500 and is asking me intel or AMD is better for MS Flightsim and video editing and...I don't know lol. I did question his PSU as it's an EVGA 750w - I don't know the model.

He's also asking for an AIO cooling recommendation. Likeliest place to buy is Micro Center.

Thanks for the help guys.
I think Microcenter has their annual "Build Your Own PC" sale coming up soon. (someone can check me on that)
Any way, they typically have decent mobo+ram+PSU combo deals.

$1500 can buy a really great system!
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Old Jan 19, 2021, 05:01 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by mizzer View Post
I think Microcenter has their annual "Build Your Own PC" sale coming up soon. (someone can check me on that)
Any way, they typically have decent mobo+ram+PSU combo deals.

$1500 can buy a really great system!
Thanks mizzer, I'll tell him to watch for the sale. I think he's wondering if he would get better/smoother performance on either brand though and bang for the buck advice.
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Old Jan 19, 2021, 10:33 PM   #4
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https://www.techspot.com/review/2185...n-5600-versus/

Hopefully this will help with deciding on a CPU. KAC knows all about this.
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Old Jan 19, 2021, 11:27 PM   #5
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Get him a combo deal on Intel 10850K/10900K w/ a Z490 motherboard (ideally an ASUS TUF or MSI Tomahawk or Gigabyte Aorus Elite) with some DDR4 3600-4000 ram. He can also throw in a 850 watts or higher PSU. Since he has the video card, in 1500 bucks here would be my split of budget.

CPU - 400-450
Motherboard - 190-250
RAM - 180-220
PSU - 120-150
AIO - 150 (I recommend Corsair H150i or EK AIO DRGB, if he doesn't want RGB he can go Arctic Freezer II 360)
Case - 150 (Can go w/ Lian Li 011 Dynamic, Phanteks P500A, or Corsair 5000X Airflow)

Also if you have money left over then definitely upgrade your monitor in the process. An LG GL850 27" would do him well. Or he can go a bit more exotic and buy a Samsung G7 27".
If he finds AMD then a 5600X plus an ASUS TUF X570 motherboard should be enough. If he is a pro user for video editing then nothing comes close (in his budget) to a 5900X.
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 01:36 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAC View Post
Get him a combo deal on Intel 10850K/10900K w/ a Z490 motherboard (ideally an ASUS TUF or MSI Tomahawk or Gigabyte Aorus Elite) with some DDR4 3600-4000 ram. He can also throw in a 850 watts or higher PSU. Since he has the video card, in 1500 bucks here would be my split of budget.

CPU - 400-450
Motherboard - 190-250
RAM - 180-220
PSU - 120-150
AIO - 150 (I recommend Corsair H150i or EK AIO DRGB, if he doesn't want RGB he can go Arctic Freezer II 360)
Case - 150 (Can go w/ Lian Li 011 Dynamic, Phanteks P500A, or Corsair 5000X Airflow)

Also if you have money left over then definitely upgrade your monitor in the process. An LG GL850 27" would do him well. Or he can go a bit more exotic and buy a Samsung G7 27".
If he finds AMD then a 5600X plus an ASUS TUF X570 motherboard should be enough. If he is a pro user for video editing then nothing comes close (in his budget) to a 5900X.

Why you recommend an intel 10c vs a 6c AMD ?

Only a pro user needs a 10c or 12c now.
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 01:39 AM   #7
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Because you can spend 50-75 extra and grab a 10850K vs a 10700K.
Same is not true for AMD.
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 01:40 AM   #8
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If serious about video editing/processing, I'd probably go with AMD 5800/5900/5950 for higher core count, as it can be very CPU intensive. For gaming alone, Intel would be viable. Basically, if the intended application can make good use of multiple cores, I'd recommend AMD.
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 04:52 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAC View Post
Because you can spend 50-75 extra and grab a 10850K vs a 10700K.
Same is not true for AMD.

The 5800x 8c is 450$ MSRP.
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 04:54 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by badsykes View Post
The 5800x 8c is 450$ MSRP.
Which is 150 over a 5600X and really not worth spending extra for.
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 05:57 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by KAC View Post
Which is 150 over a 5600X and really not worth spending extra for.
Actually is 580$
https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?d=ryzen+7+5800

i still wouldn't recommend 6c for a rtx 3080 but with this prices and market circumstances well ...
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 06:12 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acroig View Post
https://www.techspot.com/review/2185...n-5600-versus/

Hopefully this will help with deciding on a CPU. KAC knows all about this.
Thanks
Quote:
Originally Posted by KAC View Post
Get him a combo deal on Intel 10850K/10900K w/ a Z490 motherboard (ideally an ASUS TUF or MSI Tomahawk or Gigabyte Aorus Elite) with some DDR4 3600-4000 ram. He can also throw in a 850 watts or higher PSU. Since he has the video card, in 1500 bucks here would be my split of budget.

CPU - 400-450
Motherboard - 190-250
RAM - 180-220
PSU - 120-150
AIO - 150 (I recommend Corsair H150i or EK AIO DRGB, if he doesn't want RGB he can go Arctic Freezer II 360)
Case - 150 (Can go w/ Lian Li 011 Dynamic, Phanteks P500A, or Corsair 5000X Airflow)

Also if you have money left over then definitely upgrade your monitor in the process. An LG GL850 27" would do him well. Or he can go a bit more exotic and buy a Samsung G7 27".
If he finds AMD then a 5600X plus an ASUS TUF X570 motherboard should be enough. If he is a pro user for video editing then nothing comes close (in his budget) to a 5900X.
Nice, thanks KAC - I'm going to show him these posts and see where he goes from there. Much appreciated gents

@12Bass - The gaming is primarily his son on flightsim. The boy is hoping to follow in his Dad's footsteps and start flight lessons soon, and that my buddies primary reason for the upgrades.

His video editing is business related though, so I'll point this out to him in the event he decides to build a second rig for that. Thanks
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 10:26 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Lazy8s View Post
Thanks


Nice, thanks KAC - I'm going to show him these posts and see where he goes from there. Much appreciated gents

@12Bass - The gaming is primarily his son on flightsim. The boy is hoping to follow in his Dad's footsteps and start flight lessons soon, and that my buddies primary reason for the upgrades.

His video editing is business related though, so I'll point this out to him in the event he decides to build a second rig for that. Thanks
You'd probably want the most cores for most affordable price with a business related video editing work.

I would have gone with AMD because of the simple fact that you could drop a new processor in a not too old mobo and be on your merry way. I have a B450 mobo, a ryzen 2600x and i have the capability of dropping in a Zen3 Ryzen 5xxx part whenever i feel/want to. That's a span of 4 generations of Ryzen before needing a new motherboard. (Zen1, Zen+, Zen2, Zen3). Its nice to have this kind of longevity with a clear upgrade path.

Intel requires you to change your mobo each new generation of CPU.

I think with Zen3 though the AM4 socket might be at the end of the line. So any future processors might need a new socket, but im sure the cycle will start again with Zen4 and AM5(?)
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 05:43 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquach View Post
You'd probably want the most cores for most affordable price with a business related video editing work.

I would have gone with AMD because of the simple fact that you could drop a new processor in a not too old mobo and be on your merry way. I have a B450 mobo, a ryzen 2600x and i have the capability of dropping in a Zen3 Ryzen 5xxx part whenever i feel/want to. That's a span of 4 generations of Ryzen before needing a new motherboard. (Zen1, Zen+, Zen2, Zen3). Its nice to have this kind of longevity with a clear upgrade path.

Intel requires you to change your mobo each new generation of CPU.

I think with Zen3 though the AM4 socket might be at the end of the line. So any future processors might need a new socket, but im sure the cycle will start again with Zen4 and AM5(?)
He might go AMD - I forwarded acroig's link and the suggestions to him this morning. Right now he has a little time as nothing is in stock and leaves quickly when it is in stock.

But he likes longevity - got 5-6 years out of his old equipment, which is why he's considering AMD, that socket life....

I don't know. He will read and stew about it for a week or so, then order, then call me to ask if he did the right thing
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 06:52 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Sasquach View Post
Intel requires you to change your mobo each new generation of CPU.
No, not every generation. Even the mighty Intel has realized that mistake.

Quote:
I think with Zen3 though the AM4 socket might be at the end of the line. So any future processors might need a new socket, but im sure the cycle will start again with Zen4 and AM5(?)
AM4 is dead. There won't be any new chips on that platform. There are whispers of a chip the end of this year, but I have a feeling it'll be a new Threadripper, not an AM4 chip. AM5+DDR5 in 2022.

@Lazy - you can't go wrong with AMD or Intel right now. The 10th gen Intel chips (10700, 10850, 10900) offer great gaming performance, and the AMD 5900X does as well. Unfortunately, for someone who wants to milk their hardware, it's sort of a shitty time to buy. We are on the cusp of major platform upgrades from both companies. The move to DDR5 will bring significant performance increases in 2022, and that also means the current platforms are both at the end of life. Rocket Lake (the 11th gen Intel processors) will be coming out shortly, and they will work with 10th gen motherboards (Z490 chipset), but after Rocket Lake, that's it. There won't be anything else until DDR5.

The socket life of AMD is irrelevant at this point now because we won't see another AM4 chip. Out of all the chips, though, I think he would do best to grab a 5900X; those 12cores/24threads will last him a long time. Otherwise, the 10850/10900 with their 10core/20thread offering is also great and will last a while.
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Old Jan 20, 2021, 07:03 PM   #16
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No, not every generation. Even the mighty Intel has realized that mistake.



AM4 is dead. There won't be any new chips on that platform. There are whispers of a chip the end of this year, but I have a feeling it'll be a new Threadripper, not an AM4 chip. AM5+DDR5 in 2022.

@Lazy - you can't go wrong with AMD or Intel right now. The 10th gen Intel chips (10700, 10850, 10900) offer great gaming performance, and the AMD 5900X does as well. Unfortunately, for someone who wants to milk their hardware, it's sort of a shitty time to buy. We are on the cusp of major platform upgrades from both companies. The move to DDR5 will bring significant performance increases in 2022, and that also means the current platforms are both at the end of life. Rocket Lake (the 11th gen Intel processors) will be coming out shortly, and they will work with 10th gen motherboards (Z490 chipset), but after Rocket Lake, that's it. There won't be anything else until DDR5.

The socket life of AMD is irrelevant at this point now because we won't see another AM4 chip. Out of all the chips, though, I think he would do best to grab a 5900X; those 12cores/24threads will last him a long time. Otherwise, the 10850/10900 with their 10core/20thread offering is also great and will last a while.
Good info Nunz thanks! He specifically mentioned AM4 so I'll let him know about the pending EOL. He did also try to find a 5900x, but that's a hard find locally right now. I'll get him updated.

Much appreciated!
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Old Jan 21, 2021, 01:10 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunz View Post
No, not every generation. Even the mighty Intel has realized that mistake.



AM4 is dead. There won't be any new chips on that platform. There are whispers of a chip the end of this year, but I have a feeling it'll be a new Threadripper, not an AM4 chip. AM5+DDR5 in 2022.

@Lazy - you can't go wrong with AMD or Intel right now. The 10th gen Intel chips (10700, 10850, 10900) offer great gaming performance, and the AMD 5900X does as well. Unfortunately, for someone who wants to milk their hardware, it's sort of a shitty time to buy. We are on the cusp of major platform upgrades from both companies. The move to DDR5 will bring significant performance increases in 2022, and that also means the current platforms are both at the end of life. Rocket Lake (the 11th gen Intel processors) will be coming out shortly, and they will work with 10th gen motherboards (Z490 chipset), but after Rocket Lake, that's it. There won't be anything else until DDR5.

The socket life of AMD is irrelevant at this point now because we won't see another AM4 chip. Out of all the chips, though, I think he would do best to grab a 5900X; those 12cores/24threads will last him a long time. Otherwise, the 10850/10900 with their 10core/20thread offering is also great and will last a while.
The thing the end of the AM4 brings the end of DDR4 and the beggining of another series of beta testing and guinea pigs for DDR5.Also the guinea pigs will pay for the hardware.The question is do you want to pay for an experimental platform in it's infancy.This will happen on both Intel and AMD front.Are you willing to put up with crashing and instability ? Are you willing to put with slow unmmatured DDR5 and pay premium for early adopter ? Are you willing to put up with a hardware bugs that were undiscovered durring testing and may need a whole hardware replacement to be fixed ?
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Old Jan 21, 2021, 02:49 AM   #18
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Forget about the future. You buy today to get performance today. I already recommended multiple options depending on budget and usage. All are within the 1500 boners he wants to spend. Can't go wrong with either. If I had the opportunity to do it all around I would go Intel 10900K as well.
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Old Jan 21, 2021, 08:50 AM   #19
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The thing the end of the AM4 brings the end of DDR4 and the beggining of another series of beta testing and guinea pigs for DDR5.Also the guinea pigs will pay for the hardware.The question is do you want to pay for an experimental platform in it's infancy.This will happen on both Intel and AMD front.Are you willing to put up with crashing and instability ? Are you willing to put with slow unmmatured DDR5 and pay premium for early adopter ? Are you willing to put up with a hardware bugs that were undiscovered durring testing and may need a whole hardware replacement to be fixed ?
Seems like even Zen3, after 3 generations of the same chipset, has plenty of crashing, instability, and immaturity with AGESA. I'm not sure why you feel the AM5/DDR5 will be so much worse, but to be honest with you, I think the initial DDR5 will be faster than any DDR4 we see on the market right now by a good margin. Keep in mind that Ryzen struggles to even hit 4000Mhz, and Intel chips with average IMCs typically top out around 4400Mhz. The IMCs in any chip with DDR5 memory will either love high frequency, or take super low timings.

I'm not suggesting waiting for the new platform, just sharing the info that both AM4 and Intel Z490/Z590 chipsets are dead-ends. The new platforms will offer significant performance increases, and yeah, of course the price will be higher, but there will be longevity on that platform; especially if AMD does with AM5 what it did with AM4.
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Old Jan 21, 2021, 09:10 AM   #20
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Seems like even Zen3, after 3 generations of the same chipset, has plenty of crashing, instability, and immaturity with AGESA. I'm not sure why you feel the AM5/DDR5 will be so much worse, but to be honest with you, I think the initial DDR5 will be faster than any DDR4 we see on the market right now by a good margin. Keep in mind that Ryzen struggles to even hit 4000Mhz, and Intel chips with average IMCs typically top out around 4400Mhz. The IMCs in any chip with DDR5 memory will either love high frequency, or take super low timings.

I'm not suggesting waiting for the new platform, just sharing the info that both AM4 and Intel Z490/Z590 chipsets are dead-ends. The new platforms will offer significant performance increases, and yeah, of course the price will be higher, but there will be longevity on that platform; especially if AMD does with AM5 what it did with AM4.
DDR5 in it's first incarnation is not the fastest and low timing DDR5 that will apear.I remember DDR4 begun with 2133mhz in the first ever.We have now DDR4 3200cl14.But how many years did it take to land this timings and frequencies ? Would you buy an unmattured DDR5 ?
If AMD still has problems handling AM4 platform and a matured DDR4.How do you think they will handle an AM5 plus new DDR5 compatibility ?.Something tells me it will be buggy even not ocing.
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Old Jan 21, 2021, 09:28 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by badsykes View Post
DDR5 in it's first incarnation is not the fastest and low timing DDR5 that will apear.I remember DDR4 begun with 2133mhz in the first ever.We have now DDR4 3200cl14.But how many years did it take to land this timings and frequencies ? Would you buy an unmattured DDR5 ?
If AMD still has problems handling AM4 platform and a matured DDR4.How do you think they will handle an AM5 plus new DDR5 compatibility ?.Something tells me it will be buggy even not ocing.
That's a fair point and would depend on performance vs DDR4.
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Old Jan 21, 2021, 10:00 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by badsykes View Post
DDR5 in it's first incarnation is not the fastest and low timing DDR5 that will apear.I remember DDR4 begun with 2133mhz in the first ever.We have now DDR4 3200cl14.But how many years did it take to land this timings and frequencies ? Would you buy an unmattured DDR5 ?
Yes I would, because even an immature DDR5 is going to walk all over DDR4. The main thing is that the IMC of these DDR5 chips are going to be significantly better than what we have on DDR4. DDR4 is actually quite fast, no doubt, but most chips can't run the speeds the sticks are capable of due to IMC or motherboard topology limitations. It's not just about the memory speed. There are more factors to it than that.

Quote:
If AMD still has problems handling AM4 platform and a matured DDR4.How do you think they will handle an AM5 plus new DDR5 compatibility ?.Something tells me it will be buggy even not ocing.
Sounds like an AMD problem. I can't say I have any issues with Intel
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Old Jan 21, 2021, 10:09 AM   #23
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