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Old Jan 6, 2017, 06:03 PM   #1
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LordHawkwind
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ATI Technologies Why should I buy a Ryzen CPU

OK not trying to flame bait but I'm in the market for a new cpu/mobo/ram combination. I've been closely watching for Ryzen info as this would be my preferred option as I will buy a Vega GPU. However, I've been underwhelmed by the AMD benchmarks coming out and also the availability of Ryzen. It seems Ryzen will be behind Skylake/KabyLake in gaming performance which is all I care about. I don't do any serious work loads to justify an 8/16 cpu. I'm also concerned about availability of Ryzen as there is no release date yet.

I just received an email from an e-tailer I use advising that they have all the new Kaby Lake CPU's in stock and loads of 270 mobos as well. Unfortunately Ryzen and it's mobos are MIA. I can get an i7 7700K, mobo and ram for about £550 which is well within budget. If I go with an i7 6700K it would be even cheaper. I haven't owned an AMD CPU since the Athlon 64 days and to make me think about switching it would need to come in at least £100/£150 cheaper or I'd stay with Intel.

Is there anything Ryzen can offer me that I'm missing here?
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Old Jan 6, 2017, 06:12 PM   #2
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I would wait until final benches are revealed along with pricing. I've got the upgrade itch bad right now, but with ryzen being this close I just can't pull the trigger on a 7700K or 6800K until I see what AMD delivers.
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Old Jan 6, 2017, 06:31 PM   #3
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Same position as you. I'm waiting on more information from AMD. The press conference they had in Dec was a huge fail with lack of any information regarding specs\different sku\release date\price\etc. I'm hoping CES wouild bring some more news.

Waiting on gaming benchmarks to see if ill go 7700k or Zen.
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Old Jan 6, 2017, 08:27 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by lazyx View Post
Same position as you. I'm waiting on more information from AMD. The press conference they had in Dec was a huge fail with lack of any information regarding specs\different sku\release date\price\etc. I'm hoping CES wouild bring some more news.

Waiting on gaming benchmarks to see if ill go 7700k or Zen.
Same here, itching to upgrade my whole setup, still running 2500k. Can't wait to see how much of an performance boost I'll get from the newest generation Chipset+CPU+GPU+RAM combo.
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Old Jan 6, 2017, 08:52 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Ozilon View Post
Same here, itching to upgrade my whole setup, still running 2500k. Can't wait to see how much of an performance boost I'll get from the newest generation Chipset+CPU+GPU+RAM combo.
Honestly probably not much. Well a new GPU is always welcome. You can always notice the GPU uprade.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 04:26 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by LordHawkwind View Post
Is there anything Ryzen can offer me that I'm missing here?
The CPU is not out yet. It looks very promising but you can't really complain about information and availability when it's not even out, yeah? I am sure when the CPU will be out, loads of benchmarks will be also available for you to make up your mind. Not before. That's how it usually works

All in all, nobody can really answer your question. Ok, some of us could I suppose, but there are NDAs and stuff
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 08:29 AM   #7
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A cpu is a cpu. What would be missing from one vs. the other? Since it isn't out yet we can't compare performance if that's your main concern. Only you can decide if it's worth waiting for. If you've "got to have it now" buy Kaby Lake.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 09:10 AM   #8
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I think with a 2500k you would defiantly see an improvement in lows. Ryzen won't be the same price as a 7600k. The chips we have seen at least. Hell thats 230 dollars at microcenter and you get 20 off on a board. The chip they have been demonstrating is slated to be in the 500 mark according to what I've seen online. That's a kabylake and mobo. So if it's not even within your budget what's the point of waiting.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:38 AM   #9
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Honestly, you should save your pennies for a new Vega card. The only reason to upgrade would be increased core count, and games won't use more than 4 cores until >4 core chips become mainstream. Zen will help do that, but it will take a few years.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:41 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nycdarkness View Post
I think with a 2500k you would defiantly see an improvement in lows. Ryzen won't be the same price as a 7600k. The chips we have seen at least. Hell thats 230 dollars at microcenter and you get 20 off on a board. The chip they have been demonstrating is slated to be in the 500 mark according to what I've seen online. That's a kabylake and mobo. So if it's not even within your budget what's the point of waiting.
The "500" version isn't the only Ryzen sku.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 11:26 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by GTwannabe View Post
Honestly, you should save your pennies for a new Vega card. The only reason to upgrade would be increased core count, and games won't use more than 4 cores until >4 core chips become mainstream. Zen will help do that, but it will take a few years.
I'm definitely buying a Vega card anyway that's a given. This is about the CPU. I'm now leaning more towards an i5 7600k and overclock it to 4.4/5/6 on air to see where it's stable. Last time I had an AMD CPU had all sorts of chip set issues whereas Intel just works. If like nycdarkness says Ryzen is going to cost $500/£500 I'm not interested anyway and it would be way cheaper to get the i5 7600k which is meant to be better than Ryzen in gaming.

I can get an i5 7600K for £233, Mobo about £90 and 16gb DDR4 about £80 so just over £400 in total. Beginning to sound like a bargain. I know AMD are releasing an S5 and S3 version of Ryzen but they are even further off so I'm not really interested in them. My youngest (son) is hopefully going to University this autumn so I can give him my current system to replace his AMD A10 5800K and AMD 7950 so he gets a nice upgrade too.

I'm going to decide by the end of this month but unless I hear something more concrete about Ryzen e.g. release time and price it's Kaby Lake for me I'm afraid. I also think that once I pair that up with the Vega card it will be awesome!
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 02:52 PM   #12
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GTwannabe- Battlefield 1 is using all 8 of my cores on my FX8320. Playing multiplayer I am running 70-75% usage across all 8. (at 4.0Ghz)

So really, I think 8-cores is the trend moving forward.

As for Vega... Yep. I seen some of the internal slides back in November and was like.. "Heck yes.. I'm waiting." Polaris was always just a holdover. Hopefully they don't price them out of reach like Nvidia does with their gimped 1080 and Titan cards on Pascal. After using this 780Ti for a few months now.. I'm gonna go back to AMD with Vega.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 03:04 PM   #13
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BF1 has had high thread usage for a while. It's not a trend when it's been a thing for the past 2-3 BF releases.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 03:27 PM   #14
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Apparently Caveman said ALL Ryzen models will be available at launch.

The top and bottom end.

True? (Maybe he will see this and chime in?)
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 03:47 PM   #15
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I don't feel the lower ryzen cpus are going to be better at all. Competitive for sure. The 36 seconds they showed can be matched with a decent 300 dollar haswell E with an oc bump.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:07 PM   #16
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I would just wait, if I were you. I think when you put the new system together and power it up you'll be hard pressed to see any difference. Yes, Kaby Lake is faster clock for clock than Sandy Bridge, but it's by a small amount, and only in situations where you're actually CPU limited (ie: not 90+% of the time in games).

I don't understand the sudden rush to upgrade at this point in time. Kaby Lake is basically Skylake. It may or may not OC better--remains to be seen. It's basically more or less a non-release. If you didn't need Skylake when it came out last year, why do you need Kaby Lake now?

I can't tell you for sure you should get Zen, considering it's not even out. But I don't think it will hurt you to keep your options open by holding out 2-3 more months just to see. If Zen is competitively priced you may be able to get an 8 core processor for not much more than a 4 core Intel, and although you may not need the cores now, if your next CPU lasts 5 years then they may come in handy by the end.
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Old Jan 8, 2017, 02:00 AM   #17
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Just as a follow-up this is an article showing how much of an improvement Skylake is over Sandy Bridge (Kaby Lake being identical in terms of IPC):

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9483/i...h-generation/9

You're getting about a 20% clock for clock increase on average. In some very specialized cases maybe double that, while in other cases much less. Sandy Bridge already easily overclocked to the same ball park as Skylake, so there's little to no increase in clock speed. That means that 20% increase in IPC Is basically all you're getting (which is honestly pretty pathetic after 6 years). Even if you're generous and give another 5% in clock speed for Kaby Lake it doesn't add that much more.

In my opinion, what you have to ask yourself is whether a 20-25% increase in performance is actually worth spending $500 (CPU/board/memory)? At least with Ryzen you get more cores. With Kaby Lake it seems to me that you're not getting much of anything.
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Old Jan 8, 2017, 02:09 AM   #18
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Get Intel. Waiting on AMD hasn't really worked out well for many of the AMD users in the past, what, 5 years in the CPU department and maybe 3 years in the GPU department.

Also the Ryzen you are looking at won't be within your budget guaranteed.
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Old Jan 8, 2017, 09:22 AM   #19
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The bigger picture and one that troll always can never remember, is that competition
drives innovation up and prices down.

I will always buy whatever AMD has to offer for this very reason.

The funny thing, you look at many vlogs about Rizen and the same
pattern emerges: They start with how Intel has been offering minute incremental
improvements for a huge price tag...

If not for competition, we would still be paying 1000$ for 1.5GHz cpus...

This keeps the marketplace dynamic.
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Old Jan 8, 2017, 12:40 PM   #20
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Ryzen will have a 4 core 8 thread model as well so I dont know why so many insist on comparing the 8 core ryzen vs the 4 core intel. Especially considering the cost of the intel 4 core...

Any monies Im willing to save on the cpu immediately goes to a better gpu.
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Old Jan 8, 2017, 04:03 PM   #21
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Better to wait for the launch of Ryzen. The word from CES is that it is not a "paper launch" and AMD will have 8/6/4 core sku's at launch.

Source:Youtube Linustechtool\RedGamingtech. Not saying it's true or not. But it seems like that's the word on the street.
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Old Jan 8, 2017, 06:33 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nagorak View Post
Just as a follow-up this is an article showing how much of an improvement Skylake is over Sandy Bridge (Kaby Lake being identical in terms of IPC):

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9483/i...h-generation/9

You're getting about a 20% clock for clock increase on average. In some very specialized cases maybe double that, while in other cases much less. Sandy Bridge already easily overclocked to the same ball park as Skylake, so there's little to no increase in clock speed. That means that 20% increase in IPC Is basically all you're getting (which is honestly pretty pathetic after 6 years). Even if you're generous and give another 5% in clock speed for Kaby Lake it doesn't add that much more.

In my opinion, what you have to ask yourself is whether a 20-25% increase in performance is actually worth spending $500 (CPU/board/memory)? At least with Ryzen you get more cores. With Kaby Lake it seems to me that you're not getting much of anything.
You get a platform upgrade. Also, it higly depends on what your doing. If your just gaming anything past sandy bridge is a hard sell to upgrade.
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Old Jan 8, 2017, 07:24 PM   #23
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yup the reason to "upgrade" at this point is platform not performance. Which is what intel has been focusing on for the last 8 years or so.
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Old Jan 9, 2017, 08:43 AM   #24
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I saw over on [H] that AMD stated all Ryzen cpu's will be unlocked. That's a pretty dam good reason right there.
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Old Jan 9, 2017, 11:12 AM   #25
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I'm doing a 7700k rebuild in the next week or so. Upgrading from my trusty old 3570k Ivy Bridge.

It's not so much about straight clock for clock performance for me, even a 20% increase will be nice. I'm more interested in getting all the new platform goodies, like an NVME drive, USB 3.1, DDR4, updated BIOS with better system fan control, etc.
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Old Jan 9, 2017, 11:13 AM   #26
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"Why should I buy a Ryzen CPU?"

Because you'll put Caveman Jim out of a job if you don't.
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Old Jan 9, 2017, 11:15 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Ghastlyone View Post
I'm doing a 7700k rebuild in the next week or so. Upgrading from my trusty old 3570k Ivy Bridge.

It's not so much about straight clock for clock performance for me, even a 20% increase will be nice. I'm more interested in getting all the new platform goodies, like an NVME drive, USB 3.1, DDR4, updated BIOS with better system fan control, etc.
I have a friend weighing the exact same upgrade vs. waiting for Ryzen. Personally, as tempting as Kaby Lake's clocks are, I'd wait for Ryzen.
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Old Jan 9, 2017, 12:59 PM   #28
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yeah at this point im telling people to not do new builds and wait the few months for ryzen to launch to see where prices shake out for things. If you didn't do a new build on black friday then just chill.
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Old Jan 9, 2017, 01:02 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Gandalfthewhite View Post
yeah at this point im telling people to not do new builds and wait the few months for ryzen to launch to see where prices shake out for things. If you didn't do a new build on black friday then just chill.
Bingo, unless you gots to have it now!
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Old Jan 9, 2017, 01:05 PM   #30
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Vega Nano and iTX Ryzen would be nice

Getting tires of large empty cases...
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