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Old Jun 11, 2013, 12:44 AM   #61
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DRM is impossible to enforce without check-ins. The only scenario that would work is to restrict online multiplayer access, which is inline with what they're already doing on the PS3 and Vita (ie games that sell online passes via the PSN store).
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 12:44 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by logical View Post
I'll ask around, Ill be on the floor tomorrow.
Thanks. I didn't know you were down at E3, so it will be good to get that info. I've put my 'feelers' out to some of the community/marketing/PR/etc folks I know at Square Enix, Bungie, Activistion, etc.

I honestly hope this isn't true since after making a big statement like that today as a slam it would sort of make them look like idiots.

I know people think I'm biased, but I'm just a gamer and like games regardless of the hardware they are released on. So for any company to be dishonest would be bad.

I'm just hoping the folks I know misunderstood what was said.

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Originally Posted by Ciera View Post
DRM is impossible to enforce without check-ins. The only scenario that would work is to restrict online multiplayer access, which is inline with what they're already doing on the PS3 and Vita (ie games that sell online passes via the PSN store).
Completely understood. The information I'm getting is that what Sony said applies specifically to Sony. That publishers have the ability to decide for themselves what to support and not to support.

That's why I said I'm hoping it was a case of not understanding what was said correctly. I'm glad logical will be on the floor tomorrow to ask this. I wasn't able to afford E3 this year otherwise I'd ask myself.

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Old Jun 11, 2013, 12:51 AM   #63
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I honestly hope this isn't true since after making a big statement like that today as a slam it would sort of make them look like idiots.
Yeah we all know "looking like idiots" is the one and only shtick Microsoft has going for them. We wouldn't want Sony muscling in on that too
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 12:51 AM   #64
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Crash, it really seems like you're just stirring the pot.

"In addition to creating an amazing library of new titles on PlayStation 4, we're focused on delivering what gamers want most, without imposing restrictions or devaluing their PS4 purchases. For instance, PlayStation 4 won't impose any restrictions on the use of PS4 games."


"Yes, that's a good thing. We believe in the model that people embrace today with PlayStation 3 and continue to demand. We just heard you there. When a gamer buys a PS4 disc, they have the rights to the game, they can trade in the game at retail, sell it to another person, lend it to another friend or keep it forever."


"In addition, PlayStation 4 disc-based games don't need to be connected online to play."


"Or for any type of authentication. If you enjoy playing single-player games offline, PS4 won't require you to check in online periodically. And it won't stop working if you haven't authenticated within 24 hours."



I'm really not sure what additional clarification is needed at this point.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 12:54 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by Clockwork View Post
Crash, it really seems like you're just stirring the pot.

"In addition to creating an amazing library of new titles on PlayStation 4, we're focused on delivering what gamers want most, without imposing restrictions or devaluing their PS4 purchases. For instance, PlayStation 4 won't impose any restrictions on the use of PS4 games."


"Yes, that's a good thing. We believe in the model that people embrace today with PlayStation 3 and continue to demand. We just heard you there. When a gamer buys a PS4 disc, they have the rights to the game, they can trade in the game at retail, sell it to another person, lend it to another friend or keep it forever."


"In addition, PlayStation 4 disc-based games don't need to be connected online to play."


"Or for any type of authentication. If you enjoy playing single-player games offline, PS4 won't require you to check in online periodically. And it won't stop working if you haven't authenticated within 24 hours."



I'm really not sure what additional clarification is needed at this point.
Not at all. This was information I was given by a couple reporter friends down at E3. I'm seeking confirmation on this from friends who are down there, and 'logical' has already said that they will be on the floor at E3 tomorrow and will ask.

It should be easy to clear up.

If I were trying to stir the pot I wouldn't want this confirmed.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 12:55 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by crash override View Post
Not at all. This was information I was given by a couple reporter friends down at E3. I'm seeking confirmation on this from friends who are down there, and 'logical' has already said that they will be on the floor at E3 tomorrow and will ask.

It should be easy to clear up.

If I were trying to stir the pot I wouldn't want this confirmed.
Those quotes all came out of Jack Tretton's mouth.

How many other people do you need to hear it from? Seriously man, you're questioning things that nobody else (other than your so called friends/contacts) is questioning.

Reputable sites are already publishing this as factual info. Why the need to explore something that needs no further exploration?

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Old Jun 11, 2013, 12:58 AM   #67
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Those quotes all came out of Jack Tretton's mouth.

How many other people do you need to hear it from?
Because corporations are never deceptive at marketing events?

I'm saying that this is what I've heard from reporter friends at E3, and there's already another member here who is going to ask tomorrow. It's really as simple as that.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:00 AM   #68
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Not at all. This was information I was given by a couple reporter friends down at E3. I'm seeking confirmation on this from friends who are down there, and 'logical' has already said that they will be on the floor at E3 tomorrow and will ask.

It should be easy to clear up.

If I were trying to stir the pot I wouldn't want this confirmed.
Yes, that insider information you keep touting. As if the hundreds of professional journalists on the floor at E3 now don't have access to these Sony reps. Instead we should trust you, who is quoting telephone game hearsay. Also journalists at E3 obviously don't have the ability to instantaneously tweet...
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:01 AM   #69
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Because corporations are never deceptive at marketing events?
Only the ones that have something to hide, and have an agenda. Some agendas are easier to see than other's though...
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:03 AM   #70
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Yes, that insider information you keep touting. As if the hundreds of professional journalists on the floor at E3 now don't have access to these Sony reps. Instead we should trust you, who is quoting telephone game hearsay. Also journalists at E3 obviously don't have the ability to instantaneously tweet...
I'm not the only one mentioning this. There's some folks over on Kotaku mentioning they heard the same thing over in comments on this article:
http://kotaku.com/the-ps4-has-a-500g...ails-512521805

I've already said that I hope it's not true. I already have both consoles on pre-order, and regardless of what folks may think I'm not a fan of DRM.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:07 AM   #71
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Because corporations are never deceptive at marketing events?
Oh, brother.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:07 AM   #72
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I'm not the only one mentioning this. There's some folks over on Kotaku mentioning they heard the same thing over in comments on this article:
http://kotaku.com/the-ps4-has-a-500g...ails-512521805

I've already said that I hope it's not true. I already have both consoles on pre-order, and regardless of what folks may think I'm not a fan of DRM.
Like I said, used game passes for multiplayer is not new. If a publisher is dumb enough to require it for offline use or single player games, then they deserve to be raped at the register. In either case, it is not Sony's bad. Also, **** 24 hour check-ins.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:08 AM   #73
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I'm not a fan of DRM.
Yet you freely admit buying a machine that has one of the most consumer unfriendly DRM systems in place?

Well, I'm not going to argue about it. I was going to buy the X1 myself but since I've seen their attitude, what games look like on both platforms and XBox Live (I did own a 360 in the past) I think I'll pass this gen and instead just buy the PS4.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:10 AM   #74
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Yet you freely admit buying a machine that has one of the most consumer unfriendly DRM systems in place?

Well, I'm not going to argue about it. I was going to buy the X1 myself but since I've seen their attitude, what games look like on both platforms and XBox Live (I did own a 360 in the past) I think I'll pass this gen and instead just buy the PS4.
I am a fan of games, regardless of the platform they are on. I'm actually very excited about Kingdom Hearts III. Sometimes being a fan of games means buying a system that is less than stellar or does things you don't necessarily agree with.

Last I checked I haven't told anyone not to buy a PS4 or slammed them for doing so...

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Like I said, used game passes for multiplayer is not new. If a publisher is dumb enough to require it for offline use or single player games, then they deserve to be raped at the register. In either case, it is not Sony's bad. Also, **** 24 hour check-ins.
Yup, nothing new at all on either side. I completely agree. I also agree with your statement regarding offline or SP usage as well. In fact I agree with this entire post.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:13 AM   #75
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BTW, I'm trying to get a better source, but I was told that Sony clarified for a couple reporters some things about the used game policy.

They stated on stage, "We won't impose any restrictions on PS4 used games."

The clarification is that while Sony won't impose any restrictions that publishers could still impose restrictions, via the use of a 'used games pass' and that it's in the hands of the developers.

This would put them in a similar scenario to the Xbox One.

I'm guessing it's likely bull, but I'm seeing if I can get anyone that I know really well at E3 with any of the big publishers to clarify that for me, since I figured it will be a point of interest.
Publishers being dicks is different than Sony/MS being dicks. Sony left it to publishers so that they can be the ones to slit their own throats or not but the likelihood that no publisher would be stupid enough to do that on a console where competition for shelf space is pretty damn fierce.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:15 AM   #76
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Yup, nothing new at all on either side.
Mother........

You know what? Nevermind.

I give up.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:18 AM   #77
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Mother........

You know what? Nevermind.

I give up.
What? Both current gen consoles have used 'Online passes' for used titles, which is what we were referring to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drift3r View Post
Publishers being dicks is different than Sony/MS being dicks. Sony left it to publishers so that they can be the ones to slit their own throats or not but the likelihood that no publisher would be stupid enough to do that on a console where competition for shelf space is pretty damn fierce.
You would be surprised at the things I've seen publishers do or try to do at times...

I agree wholeheartedly though that 'being dicks' is bad regardless of who is doing it. I'm a firm believer in Wheaton's Law.

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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:36 AM   #78
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The slant design and slotted sides are atrocious.
They are certainly not what I would have chosen. At least it doesn't have a soda catcher on top like the XBO. Means you can stack it up with the DVR without worrying about blocking the vent.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 01:46 AM   #79
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I kind of wish that the loud crazy upset version of him wasn't a character. Here is the guy with what I assume is his normal voice and demeanor. Edit:FYI I just posted it to show the contrast in his voice and demeanor, not because of content. Edit 2: Just watched the whole thing. Around 15:20 he does a very good job expressing my feelings on XBO DRM issue. So glad Sony has decided to take a different route.

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Old Jun 11, 2013, 02:01 AM   #80
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edit: heh, already posted in the other thread

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Old Jun 11, 2013, 03:35 AM   #81
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$399 dollars
No Drm check ins
No online every 24 hours or ever if you wish
Games are yours.

"PS4 will not put any restrictions on used games, Sony's PlayStation boss Jack Tretton said today. Gamers can buy PS4 games, trade them in, lend them to friends or keep them forever. "

Not surprised it's cheaper, but I am surprised there is no restriction on second hand games. It looks like this round to Sony, but it will be interesting to see what publishers do with the possible opportunity to create extra revenue off the Xbox one and not the PS4. Could be a long game this one.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 03:43 AM   #82
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Not surprised it's cheaper, but I am surprised there is no restriction on second hand games. It looks like this round to Sony, but it will be interesting to see what publishers do with the possible opportunity to create extra revenue off the Xbox one and not the PS4. Could be a long game this one.
yip.. wondering the same.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 04:04 AM   #83
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Unless massive things change, PS4 has just owned this generation. That PS4 used video is also damn hilarious
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 04:05 AM   #84
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PS3 had restrictions on online play for used games. However, with Xbox One the restrictions on used game is for SP play (possibly implemented through cloud). That crap Sony is not implementing and even the publishers won't given Sony's stance. Heck, I can download Vita games on my PS Vita and sell it off and people can play all the games offline without spending a cent as long as they have the PS Vita memory card.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 04:26 AM   #85
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Can it play PS3 games ? Not seen it mentioned ? Assuming the used games come from your PS3 or just PS4 used games ?
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 04:30 AM   #86
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Used games discussion is about PS4 used games. I don't think there is a final word on backward compatibility but it seems it may be possible for some games based on some rando websites I have read till now.
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 05:24 AM   #87
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Ugh! wasn't planing on buying a console but thanks to a $50 best buy gift card $374 out the door for the PS4(preordered) I'm betting they will be in short supply this Christmas and money will probably be able to be made if I dont want it. Been an Xbox gamer since the real Xbox 1 but Microsoft really screwed themselves on this one, DRM and not the strongest console at $100 more. I cant believe that will spell success for them. Last playstation I have ever had was the PS1.

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Old Jun 11, 2013, 05:29 AM   #88
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Microsoft is down, call an ambulance. Wii u Wii u Wii u Wii u
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 05:52 AM   #89
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Microsoft is down, call an ambulance. Wii u Wii u Wii u Wii u
LOL. That dar is funnay
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Old Jun 11, 2013, 06:46 AM   #90
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Used games discussion is about PS4 used games. I don't think there is a final word on backward compatibility but it seems it may be possible for some games based on some rando websites I have read till now.
Looking at a few sites then it seems there is no native PS3 game support, possible support via a streaming service for PS1 and PS2 titles later but not sure what the point of that is really.

Without this then I'm not going to ditch my main console for a new one and start all over, sure I'd love to own one but it can wait now I think.
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