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Other Graphics Cards and 3D Technologies Discussion forum for any graphics hardware not provided by AMD/ATI. Also place to discuss 3D technologies such as 3D Stereo, PhysX and other interesting developments/rumours in the 3D industry.

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Old Feb 9, 2009, 01:16 PM   #211
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Zetsumei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oui View Post
Physix is cool. I love it. Why buy ATi when ATi has comparable performance and prices when there is a cool feature like this to be had when buying Nvidia.

ATi needs to step up and build physix support into their cards. How could anyone complain if it became a new standard.... exactly.
Its from a business standpoint, Nvidia got full controll over PhysX. So even though ATI can support all current things at the moment. If it becomes a standard, Nvidia can do loads of things with it to make some features only works on nvidia cards.

I personally think its bad for a hardware vendor to control an api. Just like say nvidia or ati if they would own directx or opengl it would be glide all over again.

Im one of the persons that wants to see physx to take a more important part possibly in gameplay (destruction etc). But this wont happen unless both ati and nvidia support it, and ati simply cannot support it because PhysX or rather Cuda would become a standard then and that's definitely disadvantagous for them for a business standpoint.

So we just all have to wait for a physics platform that is not owned by either ATI or Nvidia to possibly get a standard. Dx11 was the closest rumour to that, but from the dx list i did not see they really had a physics engine. Rather programmable stuff just like cuda is on the nvidia platform.
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Old Feb 12, 2009, 03:06 AM   #212
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Long time no post, but I've found something interesting

New interview with Nadeem Mohammad, PhysX product manager.
http://www.cosmosgaming.com/articles...letype=feature

Critical point - "There is a Patch coming out for Sacred 2 which enabled hardware PhysX."
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Old Feb 12, 2009, 04:58 AM   #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zogrim View Post
Long time no post, but I've found something interesting

New interview with Nadeem Mohammad, PhysX product manager.
http://www.cosmosgaming.com/articles...letype=feature

Critical point - "There is a Patch coming out for Sacred 2 which enabled hardware PhysX."

You should post moar!
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Old Feb 12, 2009, 05:40 AM   #214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zogrim View Post
Long time no post, but I've found something interesting

New interview with Nadeem Mohammad, PhysX product manager.
http://www.cosmosgaming.com/articles...letype=feature

Critical point - "There is a Patch coming out for Sacred 2 which enabled hardware PhysX."

No kidding, I missed ya!

Thanks -- was hoping for this patch for Sacred 2 -- good news indeed.
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Old Feb 13, 2009, 11:31 AM   #215
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Just some details on PhysX in Mirror's edge:

On glass:

http://209.85.133.101/translate_c?hl...LXxrYpsUuLYLbg

On cloth:

http://209.85.133.101/translate_c?hl...NwTJEJYeqqajDg

Gets me a bit angry when I read, " Just flags waving in the wind!" So silly to me.

On smoke:

http://209.85.133.101/translate_c?hl...6fDTaTGRZyCbYw

Simulated wind:

http://209.85.133.101/translate_c?hl...GMNwddLrTSKfVA


Debris and particles:

http://209.85.133.101/translate_c?hl...W0XRgRAFF7NNuw


Nice steps here -- not the end-all-be-all but very welcomed.
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Old Feb 16, 2009, 11:34 AM   #216
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zogrim View Post
Long time no post, but I've found something interesting

New interview with Nadeem Mohammad, PhysX product manager.
http://www.cosmosgaming.com/articles...letype=feature

Critical point - "There is a Patch coming out for Sacred 2 which enabled hardware PhysX."
OMG that would be so awesome! Especially since I got a GTX280 1 hour ago

If PhysX support comes in patches, that's a very good sign IMO. Well not that I think its gonna mean that much difference, but if developers have done it once they're more likely to support it in future games I think.
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Old Feb 17, 2009, 06:20 AM   #217
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Don't know if it is GPU Physics but this title and the developer did mention PhysX with Cloth and hair Physics:

http://www.ogre3d.org/forums/viewtop...45457&start=25


Quote:
The cloth and our main characters hair are indeed simulated in realtime. We use PhysX and NxOGRE for that purpose.

Here is a video from you tube -- pretty nice animations:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6c2g4PQm6yc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HG1uG...eature=related
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 10:36 AM   #218
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Default PhysX UT3 levels play horribly on my rig!

You see my specs, and I can't understand why the game performance deteriorates so much, but only on the PhysX levels of UT3. I'm running the very latest Forceware drivers.

I'll start a game, and the performance is pretty good for about three minutes, then the lag, chop, and crappy frame rates start. The non-PhysX levels play just fine!

I can't find a reason for this, and I can't find a specific location in the Forum for these kinds of problems. I don't want to start a new thread in the wrong location because when you do that somebody always starts b*tching your head off. HELP!
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 10:47 AM   #219
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That's pretty much the way those levels have always been. On my old 8800gts 320 I had to lower the settings tremendously to get them playable. Even on the 285 I have now they run a whole lot slower than the regular maps but it's still waaay playable at the same IQ settings I use for the regular maps.

I guess it's just the extra Physics that slows it down. Funny you mention these, I was just playing them with my son 2 nights ago, trying to explain to him what PhysX does.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 10:50 AM   #220
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Oh, and make sure hardware PhysX is ticked in the settings menu!
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 11:38 AM   #221
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Jokerzwild
Quote:
I guess it's just the extra Physics that slows it down.
That's right) But comparing PhysX maps with regular maps in perfomance case isn't the right way. Right one - compare PhysX maps with hardware acceleration enabled/disabled.

--------
One thing I've forgot to mention
Trine, title from Frozenbyte (creators of Shadowgrounds series) is likely targeting GPU PhysX too

From official forums
Racoon (it's me): "So, maybe Trine will take advantage from hardware PhysX too, like Shadowgrounds Survivor ?)"
fb_joel
(developer) "Yeah PhysX hardware is supported, to some extent at least. I doubt we have much time to add many new features but we'll see. Our main focus is on making the gameplay as fun as can be."

http://frozenbyte.com/board/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1612

------
I'm also downloading Empire:Total War demo from Steam now - to see finally is PhysX support included or not
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 12:00 PM   #222
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I'm finishing my PC upgrade for Empire:Total War and looking forward to that title very much so. I've heard so many things:

1) It doesn't offer PhysX

2) It does offer PhysX

3) It uses Cuda for some Physics


Hoping that it does offer some level of GPU physics that it may raise the bar of Physics over-all in a title of this magnitude and genre.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 01:57 PM   #223
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scred 2 is very nice with the integrated physics, although a 21gb game required some lofty GBs.
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 02:52 PM   #224
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Sadly, Empire: Total War doesn't include any parts of PhysX SDK, CUDA, or other GPGPU technologies.. I'll remove it from the list
Game is pretty cool though.. awesome graphics and very dumb naval AI
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Old Feb 20, 2009, 03:59 PM   #225
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nofool View Post
You see my specs, and I can't understand why the game performance deteriorates so much, but only on the PhysX levels of UT3. I'm running the very latest Forceware drivers.

I'll start a game, and the performance is pretty good for about three minutes, then the lag, chop, and crappy frame rates start. The non-PhysX levels play just fine!

I can't find a reason for this, and I can't find a specific location in the Forum for these kinds of problems. I don't want to start a new thread in the wrong location because when you do that somebody always starts b*tching your head off. HELP!
I found the possible resolution to this when I was researching making UT3 PhysX levels work on a system without a PPU or CUDA capable card, see post #2 in this thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by caveman-jim View Post
How to play Unreal Tournament 3 PhysX level on a system without nVidia card installed - Link
Which if you follow through to HardOCP, you see this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seb1
You must replace some dll's in the UT3 folders from the 2.7.3 PhysX runtime.
Go to:
<installation directory>\Unreal Tournament 3\Binaries\PhysXLocal\ and replace the file PhysXLoader.dll with the one from C:\Windows\System32\
<installation directory>\Unreal Tournament 3\Binaries\ and replace NxCooking.dll and NxCharacter.dll with the ones from C:\Program Files\AGEIA Technologies\demos\,
and replace PhysXCore.dll with the one in C:\Program Files\AGEIA Technologies\v2.7.3\

With this workaround that slowdown after a few minutes does not occur anymore.
http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.ph...06&postcount=6
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Old Feb 23, 2009, 01:48 PM   #226
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First Sacred 2 PhysX Effects preview
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,6...g-Physx-patch/
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Old Feb 23, 2009, 02:24 PM   #227
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That's what I thought the initial hold up with Sacred 2 but good to know more info on this title.

Wonder what title will be the first to add game-changing Physics from PhysX?

Still very pleased with eye-candy and features that enhance the atmosphere and don't dismiss these aspects so easy as some. Eye-candy, atmosphere with game-changing Physics would be the ideal situation but certainly understand it doesn't happen over night.
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Old Feb 23, 2009, 02:32 PM   #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SIrPauly View Post
Still very pleased with eye-candy and features that enhance the atmosphere and don't dismiss these aspects so easy as some. Eye-candy, atmosphere with game-changing Physics would be the ideal situation but certainly understand it doesn't happen over night.
You forgot to mention "flexibility". You're slipping.
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Old Feb 23, 2009, 02:34 PM   #229
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Wonder what title will be the first to add game-changing Physics from PhysX?
Well, no)

"Since Sacred 2 has to stay playable without Physx effects and since it is not easy to synchronize Physx features via a Close Net Server structure, the GPU physics are restricted to optional effects."

"Those enhancements only affect the visualization and the atmosphere, but not the gameplay."
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Old Feb 23, 2009, 03:43 PM   #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zogrim View Post
Well, no)

"Since Sacred 2 has to stay playable without Physx effects and since it is not easy to synchronize Physx features via a Close Net Server structure, the GPU physics are restricted to optional effects."

"Those enhancements only affect the visualization and the atmosphere, but not the gameplay."
I understand that Sacred 2 doesn't offer game-play and PhysX in this specific title is used for visualization and atmosphere aspects -- which is still nice.

What would be nice to know is what title will be the first to offer game-changing Physics from a game-play point-of-view ? Pretty tough to answer that question right now but eventually there may be a title moving forward that will truly change game-play.

Wonder what title will the first to offer these game-play changes and curious what the time-line may be?

Summer? Fall? Winter? 2010? 2011?
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Old Feb 23, 2009, 03:52 PM   #231
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Summer? Fall? Winter? 2010? 2011?
Q4 2009 - Q1 2010, I think) Something PhysX SDK 3.0 and APEX based, optimized for GT300

-----
Also, if you are going to GDC 09, don't miss PhysX specific sessions:

NVIDIA APEX: From MIRROR'S EDGE to Pervasive Cinematic Destruction

NVIDIA APEX: High-Definition Physics with Clothing and Vegetation

Morpheme & PhysX: A New Approach to Combining Character Animation and Simulation
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Old Feb 23, 2009, 04:32 PM   #232
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Thanks.

Looking forward to this from PhysX:

Rigid Body acceleration, scalability or flexibility( used this word for Acroig, hehe) through APEX, and game-changing Physics.

While waiting for improved and a more mature PhysX, compute Shaders or anything that can take advantage of GPU Physics, will enjoy what is offered in Sacred 2, Mirror's edge Cryostasis, etc..
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Old Mar 5, 2009, 11:43 AM   #233
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Sacred 2 PhysX effects video from Cebit 09

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ux9UTB5_sA
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Old Mar 5, 2009, 01:13 PM   #234
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"Let me get rid of them" Talking about the enemies in the game --that was funny!

The last effect was some neat.
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Old Mar 6, 2009, 07:24 AM   #235
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Sacred 2 PhysX video now has it's own news page
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,6...-effects/News/

HD version is available too
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Old Mar 6, 2009, 11:21 AM   #236
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The HD video made a big difference seeing the effects.
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Old Mar 9, 2009, 08:31 AM   #237
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News from development front
"Emergent Integrates Gamebryo LightSpeed with NVIDIA PhysX Technology for Wii Development"
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/090309/20090309005428.html?.v=1

Nothing critical for GPU PhysX at all, but it pleasant to see PhysX spreading widely
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Old Mar 12, 2009, 12:05 AM   #238
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Originally Posted by DBT View Post
Its from a business standpoint, Nvidia got full controll over PhysX. So even though ATI can support all current things at the moment. If it becomes a standard, Nvidia can do loads of things with it to make some features only works on nvidia cards.

I personally think its bad for a hardware vendor to control an api. Just like say nvidia or ati if they would own directx or opengl it would be glide all over again.

Im one of the persons that wants to see physx to take a more important part possibly in gameplay (destruction etc). But this wont happen unless both ati and nvidia support it, and ati simply cannot support it because PhysX or rather Cuda would become a standard then and that's definitely disadvantagous for them for a business standpoint.

So we just all have to wait for a physics platform that is not owned by either ATI or Nvidia to possibly get a standard. Dx11 was the closest rumour to that, but from the dx list i did not see they really had a physics engine. Rather programmable stuff just like cuda is on the nvidia platform.
What ATi needs to do, is to make a trade... They should agree to support physx to make it a standard, but make nV sign a contract stating that nV must share all technology related to future physx iterations. That way, nV wins because they have a new standard, and ATi wins because they can support physx, and don't need to worry about nV pulling any shenanigans with it.
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Old Mar 12, 2009, 05:41 AM   #239
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An Interview with Software Manager Chris Daniel from DH:

http://www.driverheaven.net/intervie...interviewid=14


Quote:
The PhysX team is currently also working on a new technology called APEX that empowers artists to quickly create fully interactive in-game destruction, clothing and vegetation. APEX will dramatically reduce the time to create physics content in games and allows for automatic scaling of physics content to the performance of the platform, be it Wii, Xbox, PS or PC. Game developers will be able to make systems with high end GPUs automatically have more PhysX content generated for them! Stay tuned!
Apex must be getting close which is good.
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Old Mar 12, 2009, 04:21 PM   #240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SIrPauly View Post
An Interview with Software Manager Chris Daniel from DH:

http://www.driverheaven.net/intervie...interviewid=14




Apex must be getting close which is good.
That is really good to hear. Anything that increases the chances of GPU physics catching hold is a great thing for gamers.
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