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Old Oct 15, 2003, 01:27 AM   #1
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Hamidxa
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Default Time Traveler?

Dont know why, but im in a conspiracy theory mood.
John Tritor as he likes to be called caused quite a stir with his time travelling theories.

Heres a video that anomalies.net made to demonstrate his so called time travelling machine:

http://www.anomalies.net/time_traveler/jump1.wmv

heres a link to the article:
http://www.anomalies.net/time_travel/


Hmmm, funky red laser pointer. Never seen one like that before, ive seen the green lasers, but never a red, and never one that emits for only a few feet.

Weird, if not stupid or unbelievable, but still makes you wonder at least: what if....
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 01:47 AM   #2
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real proof would be if they can travel 15mins ahead of time

If they disappear, and then reappear after 15mins, then its true.
if they say its impossible and u cant be that precise, they are BS.

Example:

So-called Time Traveller is in some guy's house. Now, the person needs to have a quality camcorder, not some crap that has crappy image quality. a Quality one. Heres the test. Set time machine to 15mins from now. Set a clock to a certain time. Now, turn on time machine and go thru portal. Make sure it is filmed good. When 15mins is up portal should reappear at some place (assuming u also can detect the destination) within the room and the clock would be a few seconds or mins from the jump time (assuming jump is instantaneous).
If that happens, theory proven. If not, something is fishy and its all a conspiracy scham.



Also note how "time travellers" never seem to return after they claim to come here and go back to their own time.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 01:51 AM   #3
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Wow, that movie was ****ing retarded. Jesus Christ, that was the lamest, gayest **** I've ever seen. If you actually believe this, then you need to be shot, really bad....right in the face. I mean **** dude, Jesus ****...
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 01:53 AM   #4
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A laser pointer......
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8) However, let this one fact not be escaping YOUR notice, beloved ones, that one day is with Jehovah as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day. 9) Jehovah is not slow respecting his promise, as some people consider slowness, but he is patient with YOU because he does not desire any to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance.
Like 12Bass says, critical thinking and the scientific method are probably the best tools we have to avoid it. (bias)

However, this method relies on repeatable, falsifiable hypotheses and theories. Only an extremely small spectrum of time and space can be rendered into these, or at least a good approximation of such.

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“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.” ― Daniel J. Boorstin
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 01:55 AM   #5
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The beam doesn't even look real and it doesn't go where he points it.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 01:55 AM   #6
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laser pointer + tool chest + electronic gizmos = instant time machine
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 01:57 AM   #7
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TIME TRAVEL, I CAN WRITE PAGES AND PAGES ON THE SUBJECT AND DIFFRENT THEORIES AND SO ON, BUT ITS 3 AM SO IM GOING TO BED (bah caps i aint retyping)
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 02:03 AM   #8
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if time travel was possible wouldnt known about about it by now...and alot eariler?...
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 02:03 AM   #9
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LOL i know, its2AM here, precisely why my mind is infatuated with conspiracy theories. All day long in and out of classes analyzing circuits, sinusoids, power transform generators, quantum mechanincs, and time related fucntions in quantum physics....now conspiracy theories. Weigh in the 3AM factor, and you get instant "what if's". Im sure in the morning ill be laughing my ass off.
'Til then....hmmmmm

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Old Oct 15, 2003, 02:04 AM   #10
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OMG!!!1111

He stole the machine from Sliders
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 02:06 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
LOL i know, its 2AM, precisely why my mind is infatuated with conspiracy theories. All day long analyzing circuit, sinusoids, power transform generators, quantum mechanincs, and now conspiracy theories. Weigh in the 3AM factor, and you get instant "what if's". Im sure in the morning il be laughing my ass off.
Look into "skull and bones" and it's connection to "Yale".

Let me know if you find anything.
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2 Peter 3:3) For YOU know this first, that in the last days there will come ridiculers with their ridicule, proceeding according to their own desires 4) and saying: “Where is this promised presence of his? Why, from the day our forefathers fell asleep [in death], all things are continuing exactly as from creation’s beginning.” 5) For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice [...]

8) However, let this one fact not be escaping YOUR notice, beloved ones, that one day is with Jehovah as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day. 9) Jehovah is not slow respecting his promise, as some people consider slowness, but he is patient with YOU because he does not desire any to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance.
Like 12Bass says, critical thinking and the scientific method are probably the best tools we have to avoid it. (bias)

However, this method relies on repeatable, falsifiable hypotheses and theories. Only an extremely small spectrum of time and space can be rendered into these, or at least a good approximation of such.

-RFtinkerer

“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.” ― Daniel J. Boorstin
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 02:15 AM   #12
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Google is your friend. All i could find is that its some top secret club consisting of Yale students/alumni/etc. Whats the big deal about it?

Quoted:

"From Publishers Weekly
Robbins (Quarterlife Crisis) begins by setting readers up with the ridiculous myth of Yale's Skull and Bones, an exclusive society whose powerful members including both presidents Bush are sworn to secrecy for life about the club's activities: the myth says that the society's members form a clique that rules the world. Robbins then proposes demystifying the group. On the one hand, she propagates the myth, spelling out how Bonesmen have promoted one another in enormously successful political and business careers; they presided over the creation of the atomic bomb as well as the CIA, she says. On the other hand, Robbins turns up much that is prosaic, as she traces the society's origins back to 1832, when William Russell founded it as retribution for a classmate's having been passed over by Phi Beta Kappa; she discovers that the club's cryptic iconography is derived from German university societies. She reveals the inventory of the Tomb (an evocative name for what is essentially a frat house) and details about the group's oddly juvenile fraternal ritual. The narrative never gets more dramatic than Robbins staking out the Tomb for President George W. Bush during Yale's tercentennial celebrations in 2002, and while she relies heavily on the testimony of many Bonesmen, she never names names. While the book may demystify Skull and Bones, it also imparts the sense that Robbins, herself a Yale graduate and member of a rival society, believes in Yalies' elitist entitlement to power and prestige.
"

Last edited by Hamidxa : Oct 15, 2003 at 02:17 AM.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 02:16 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
Google is your friend. All i could find is that its some top secret club consisting of Yale students/alumni/etc. Whats the big deal about it?
It's members. They control.... THE WORLD <sinister laughter here>
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2 Peter 3:3) For YOU know this first, that in the last days there will come ridiculers with their ridicule, proceeding according to their own desires 4) and saying: “Where is this promised presence of his? Why, from the day our forefathers fell asleep [in death], all things are continuing exactly as from creation’s beginning.” 5) For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice [...]

8) However, let this one fact not be escaping YOUR notice, beloved ones, that one day is with Jehovah as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day. 9) Jehovah is not slow respecting his promise, as some people consider slowness, but he is patient with YOU because he does not desire any to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance.
Like 12Bass says, critical thinking and the scientific method are probably the best tools we have to avoid it. (bias)

However, this method relies on repeatable, falsifiable hypotheses and theories. Only an extremely small spectrum of time and space can be rendered into these, or at least a good approximation of such.

-RFtinkerer

“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.” ― Daniel J. Boorstin
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 02:18 AM   #14
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Heh yeah, i just found out that part right before i saw your post.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 03:32 AM   #15
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Time travel into the future does exist and has already been demonstrated. There was this cool show on discovery or TLC, can't remember, which focused on quantum physics. In the show they talk about an experiment using two syncronized atomic clocks. One clock was on the ground and one was in a plane. They flew the plane around for a while and upon landing compared the two clocks. The one in the plane was something like a few millionths of a second faster. As you approach the speed of light time slows down relative to those who are not moving. They mentioned someone traveling on a space ship near the speed of light for a given time period, like a year. Upon returning to earth many decades had passed and everyone he knew was dead. The traveler had not jumped through time but merely experienced a different rate of it's progression. In the show a theory for travel into the past was presented but it was of course all theoretical and sounded quite complicated. The physicist explaining it used a merry-go-round in trying to explain it.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 03:38 AM   #16
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I'll just post this little snippet from here to go along with my fuzzy memories of a tv show.

Quote:
Einstein proposed that the measured interval between two events depends on how the observer is moving. Crucially, two observers who move differently will experience different durations between the same two events. The effect is often described using the "twin paradox." Suppose that Sally and Sam are twins. Sally boards a rocket ship and travels at high speed to a nearby star, turns around and flies back to Earth, while Sam stays at home. For Sally the duration of the journey might be, say, one year, but when she returns and steps out of the spaceship, she finds that 10 years have elapsed on Earth. Her brother is now nine years older than she is. Sally and Sam are no longer the same age, despite the fact that they were born on the same day. This example illustrates a limited type of time travel. In effect, Sally has leaped nine years into Earth's future.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 03:48 AM   #17
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That doesnt make sense though. Are you saying she aged 1 year during a period of 10 years (because she was gone that long in earth years), or did that rate of speed reverse the aging process somehow: I.E. No wrinkles, thinning of hair, etc etc? Otherwise, she could take a wristwatch with her (kinetic) and it would show 10 years elapsed, HOW COULD IT NOT? That is my question.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 04:03 AM   #18
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She aged 1 year everyone else aged 10 because she was going so fast that for her time slowed down by a factor of 10. Everyone on earth experienced normal space time and to them the woman went on a 10 year trip.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 04:18 AM   #19
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Im still not convinced by that / THE THEORY of Time Travel.

I mean all of the phsics/advanced math/upper level engineering aside, common sense tells you otherwise.

Velocity and time are linearly dependant on one another.

For instance, velocity is a rate of speed over a given period of time:

Lets say im walking a marathon for 3 hours. I walk at a rate of 5 miles per hour. Means i walked a distance of 15 miles in 3 hours.

Lets say space traveler suzy is traveling in a spaceship for 3 hours at the rate of 5,000,000 mph. She would have traveled a distance of 15,000,000 miles in the same span of time it took me to travel 15 miles.

The velocities are obviously different, as are the distances covered, but what remains CONSTANT is Time : 15 minutes elapsed for each of us to traverse those respective distances.
This interpretation is basic physics 101. EVERYTHING ELSE IS THEORY.

The only case where i can see physical proof of this is with light itself emitted from the sun. Its about 7.5 minutes old. So in a sense, we are looking into the past when we look at the sun. Not going into the future, but more like time travel into the past.
BUT that beam/wave of light is STILL 7.5 mins old. Just because it came to us a few minutes after it left doesnt make it any less old. The wave still "ages" 7.5 mins, just as we here on Earth age that much waiting to receive it.

Catch my drift?
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 04:20 AM   #20
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This is an easy way to look at it:

We can move freely in 3 dimensions - up/down, left/right and backwards/forwards. Now extend those 3 dimensions to 4 by adding time, however time is a bit special since you can only move in one direction (forward).

Now..postulate two things:

1) You cannot exceed (or acheive 100%) the speed of light
2) Everyone and everything moves constantly at the speed of light through 4-dimensional space-time space.

Now.. as you start moving in the 3 spatial dimensions you will have less speed to move in the time dimension (because you used part of your light-speed on moving spatially) so your clock will appear to slow down to one that is at rest relatively to you. You, on the other hand, will not notice any difference within your reference-system. It will not feel like time is slowing down, you will not age any slower etc. But when you return to your origin you will notice that less time has passed and others will have aged more than you.

If you travel at a significant amount of the speed of light the difference will grow since you will have less "speed" left for moving through the time dimension.

Now.. this also means time will stand still at the speed of light (all photons have age zero...), but of course no object with mass (at rest) can acheive the speed of light.


So.. you are in fact not really "travelling" through time... at least not in any sense different than we are all travelling through time (forward) - you're just slowing down a bit.

Second.. it doesn't help trying to go backwards in time at all.


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Old Oct 15, 2003, 04:28 AM   #21
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It is all THEORY still. No substantial evidence to support any of the claims. I will once again refer you to this EVEN More rudimentary observation of mine:

The only case where i can see physical proof of this is with light itself emitted from the sun. Its about 7.5 minutes old. So in a sense, we are looking into the past when we look at the sun. Not going into the future, but more like time travel into the past.

BUT that beam/wave of light is STILL 7.5 mins old. Just because it came to us a few minutes after it left doesnt make it any less old. The wave still "ages" 7.5 mins, just as we here on Earth age that much waiting to receive it.

Thus, even if waves do not "age" in the sense that we denote aging, common sense tells you:

IT TOOK THAT (beam traveling at the speed of light mind you)
7.5 mins to reach us.
Whereas, we here on earth, were waiting exactly 7.5 mins to see it.

We "aged" 7.5 mins during the waiting period.
The beam of light (photons and all) still took 7.5 mins to make it here, thus it aged the same amt of time. Its traveling at light speed, since IT IS LIGHT, but we can still measure its time, and its exactly the same as how long we waited for it.

Therefore if a person was riding on that beam, it would still have taken her 7.5 mins to make it here. She too would have aged that amount of time in the process...
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 04:41 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
The velocities are obviously different, as are the distances covered, but what remains CONSTANT is Time : 15 minutes elapsed for each of us to traverse those respective distances.
This interpretation is basic physics 101. EVERYTHING ELSE IS THEORY.
Yes, both people would experience 15 minutes, but not relative to each other. Time progresses at a normal rate as viewed by each person but when viewed from the outside time seems different. If the person on earth were to see the goings on inside the space ship they would appear in slow motion, while the person on the space ship would perceive those on earth as going really fast. If you read some stuff on general relativity it would probably be easier to understand. This stuff doesn't use common sense. Remember that these time dilation effects are not theory, they have been observed and measured already.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 04:58 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
Therefore if a person was riding on that beam, it would still have taken her 7.5 mins to make it here. She too would have aged that amount of time in the process...
That's right, she would have aged 7.5 minutes, but we would have aged more according to her viewpoint.

Quote:
From the article:

Subatomic particles can be propelled at nearly the speed of light in large accelerator machines. Some of these particles, such as muons, have a built-in clock because they decay with a definite half-life; in accordance with Einstein's theory, fast-moving muons inside accelerators are observed to decay in slow motion. Some cosmic rays also experience spectacular time warps. These particles move so close to the speed of light that, from their point of view, they cross the galaxy in minutes, even though in Earth's frame of reference they seem to take tens of thousands of years.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 05:09 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
It is all THEORY still. No substantial evidence to support any of the claims.
Actually, there is tons of evidence supporting the "slow-down" of time (between reference-systems in relative motion to each other). There is no dispute in science concerning this. Read any modern physiscs book.

And someone riding a photon (at the speed of light) would appear frozen in time to an outside observer.

Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
Therefore if a person was riding on that beam, it would still have taken her 7.5 mins to make it here. She too would have aged that amount of time in the process...
Not true. See above and my previous post.


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Old Oct 15, 2003, 05:20 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
Im still not convinced by that / THE THEORY of Time Travel.

I mean all of the phsics/advanced math/upper level engineering aside, common sense tells you otherwise.
Hmmm, Hamidxa....Einstein....Hamixida.....Einstein.... I think i'm gonna go with Einstein.

They've proved the faster you go the slower time goes with the atomic clocks and the airplane. They theorized it should happen that way and tested it and it did.

The problem is that to achieve any worthwhile effects you have to approach the speed of light which is not anywhere near possible.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 05:41 AM   #26
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Whenever I read about Star Trek/Superscience sort of stuff time travel always comes out ahead as the most doable.
That and teleporting.

Scientists think they have it figured out, and if they could just figure out a way to harness all the energy of Jupiter they could do it to!

I have a couple of random thoughts on time travel.

1. I don't believe it is impossible.
Something that is impossible is just that, impossible. Could I score with Uma Thurman? No, that is impossible. There is no scientist on this planet that could figure out a way for me to score with Uma Thurman.
That is an example of something that is impossible.
However many scientists have worked out theories that lead to time travel. For me just the idea that these theories exist cause me to pull it out of the 'impossible' category.
I really wish they would work on Uma.
Something else to consider, there have been experiments in the Quantum Physics field already that have demonstrated time travel.
Of course the power curve is something else entirely. When you start asking them about human time travel those same scientists start saying things like 'It would require harnessing all the power that is contained in Jupiter'.
Ouch.

2. I refuse to rule out what we have not invented yet.
Go back 150 years and tell some of the smartest people on the planet that in a mere 150 years we would have gone to the moon, and back. Tell them that we would build planes that could travel faster then there voice across the room.
Then tell them that MATTER is ENERGY.

They will give you all kinds of reasons why you are nuts.
I see no reason why the same kind of thing couldn't apply here.
Maybe it would take all the energy of Jupiter to have a human travel in time.
But maybe we haven't learned all there is to learn about energy.
You simply cannot know that.

3. If a civilization can time travel they can do other 'impossible' things.
As a kid I used to point out that time travel cannot be real because we have never met a time traveler. It seems like a paradox.
But I don't think it is anymore.
Who is to say that before someone time travels they don't make damn sure that they don't show up over NYC on September 11th 2001?
We are working on invisibility projects right this very second. By the time we can do something like time travel that will be an old trick.
As will avoiding radar and many other things.

4. Why do UFO's have to be from other worlds?
Why not from the future?

5. Is time really a straight line? Or is it a series of connecting roads?
Think about it for a second. If time iteslf is a straight line, AND if it is possible to time travel, AND you are not at the exact beginning of that line then free will IS an illusion. Simple as that. In such a circumstance the only people with free will are the people at the beginning of the time line. For them the theory of 'well we haven't met a time traveler yet' isn't logical. I think we can safely prove that we are not at the front of the time line. Physics work in such a way that you can go forward in time as well as backward. Seems to me that if we were at the front then physics wouldn't work like that.

However, if time is like a river, with many, many branches and crossings and such, then we can have free will, this doesn't present a problem.
Although this begs more questions.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 09:04 AM   #27
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I actually thought this guy might be really, but after seeing the video it just looks like total BS.

Right off I thought the background looked weird, and it probably does so because it's a blue screen. The laser is obviously bull, and is just some crappy digital effects job. The light at the end just screams video editing. Complete and useless crap.

And considering this guy didn't metion or hint at what started, or began the move to get rid of civil liberties in the states (read: Sept. 11) before it happened, then he seems quite bogus.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 09:36 AM   #28
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I would have thought that by 2035 classified documents would not be typed on a typewriter and cheaply copied at Kinkos. I would also imagine that MS Visio will have evolved to the point that it looks better than the version this nut used.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 09:41 AM   #29
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Hey, maybe he can get us some copies of Duke Nukem 3D.
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Old Oct 15, 2003, 09:46 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hamidxa
This interpretation is basic physics 101. EVERYTHING ELSE IS THEORY.
Exactly... you learn about relativity in physics 214 (for me) .

But seriously, this has been demonstrated many times in many different ways, just as Einstein predicted. So I would have to agree with Einstein on this one UNTIL you reach the speed of light, then it gets wacky and theoretical.
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