Go Back   Rage3D » Rage3D Discussion Area » Gaming and Computing Forums » Console Gaming
Rage3D Subscribe Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Console Gaming A place to discuss our favourite past and present gaming consoles. Talk about your favorite games, get nostalgic and share tips and strategies.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Dec 30, 2007, 12:44 AM   #1
Advertisement (Guests Only)

Login or Register to remove this ad
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default question about interlacing, combing with some ps3 games.....

I have a issue and dont have a 100% answer to why its doing my issue i see.

Ok i have a sony wega kv-30hs420 widescreen crt hdtv, and by reading on these forums and google searches my tv doesnt naturely support 720p it just secretly upconverts it to 1080i. I say secretly because when i'm in the service menu and load a 720p source I think i see the video modes change within the tv but it still says 720p.

Ok I have a 60gig ps3 connected to my sony via hdmi cable input #7, now what I see is in some but not all ps3 games and even ps2 games, I see interlacing, now the way this issue looks like is in a game like uncharted drakes for an example if you pan/move the screen in a horizontal direction, still/static images like a tree, rock, vehicles, buildings, anything, the image goes like out of focus, it creates like a double itsself image, vibrate, shake. The whole screen is actually producing this issue but more noticeable on still/static images.

Now it can also be called combing artifacts that I'm seeing, becuase if I hook up my ps3 to a SDTV using composite cables I can actually see the thin comb lines when its doing this issue I describe above.

Now recently in the past 5 months I had 5 different hdtv's lcd's displays, the last one being a 800 dollar sharp aqous native 720p 32 incher. All these displays had the same issue I'm describing here thats why they been returned and found this sony sega on craiglist.

Also those ps3 demo stations at the stores with those sony bravias displays like at bestbuy, when I try those demos like motorstorm, folklore, ghost recon etc it does the same thing i'm describing here. Can anyone help and know whats going on here?

Games that have this issue are: Uncharted, resistance, folklore, heanvenyl sword, motorstorm, ghost recon, full auto, virtual tennis 3, timeshift and much more.

Games that have no issues are: ninja gaiden sigma, call of duty 4, ridge racer 7, ratchet clank.

Some ps2 games that have this issue are: snake eater, code veronica and more.

Thanks......
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 08:31 AM   #2
Clockwork
Radeon Arctic Islands
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: United States Wisconsin
Posts: 14,575
Clockwork knows why the caged bird singsClockwork knows why the caged bird singsClockwork knows why the caged bird singsClockwork knows why the caged bird singsClockwork knows why the caged bird sings


Default

You didn't like the answers you got the first time?

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33910888


I see you posted the same thread before at Beyond3d too...


Clockwork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 10:56 AM   #3
Deaderinred
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 20,052
Deaderinred once won a refrigerator on 'The Price is Right'Deaderinred once won a refrigerator on 'The Price is Right'Deaderinred once won a refrigerator on 'The Price is Right'Deaderinred once won a refrigerator on 'The Price is Right'Deaderinred once won a refrigerator on 'The Price is Right'Deaderinred once won a refrigerator on 'The Price is Right'


Default

i prefer a fine tooth comb myself.
Deaderinred is offline   Reply With Quote
Advertisement (Guests Only)
Login or Register to remove this ad
Old Dec 30, 2007, 01:59 PM   #4
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clockwork View Post
You didn't like the answers you got the first time?

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33910888


I see you posted the same thread before at Beyond3d too...


No one posted a answer on that thread. Its ok i'm not in a hurry i'll just post a thread until we get a proffesinal response to this issue.
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 02:41 PM   #5
neight
Radeon R420
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 238
neight is still being judged by the masses


Default

Are you sure you're just not seeing a 30fps and below framerate? The games you listed as not having this issue popped out at me as all being 60fps games IIRC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clockwork View Post
You didn't like the answers you got the first time?

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33910888


I see you posted the same thread before at Beyond3d too...


If you read in this thread he seems to have a serious fixation over this. Someone posted other threads in other forums he made(post #4). http://www.yougamers.com/forum/showthread.php?p=794274

Last edited by neight : Dec 30, 2007 at 05:36 PM.
neight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 03:00 PM   #6
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by neight View Post
Are you sure you're just not seeing a 30fps and below framerate? The games you listed as not having this issue popped out at me as all being 60fps games IIRC.
Ok fine we might be getting somewhere, I heard the same response you just said at another forum www.avsforum.com. Thats what i'm trying to do here is troubleshoot this issue for "WHY" this is happening.

Now is that what happens when a game is 30 frames or below you see that interlacing issue? Now let me get this out there straight again, I'm not talking about any screen tearing, no ghosting "I have a crt BTW" this issue i'm seeing is a whole different issue.

Again all you do basically is stand still in any game like uncharted, then move/pan the screen in a left and right "horizontal" direction, then by doing this look and pay attention to any still/static images like a tree in uncharted, what you see it happen is the tree will like double it self, it jsut wont be a constand still image no more. Again this is NOT GHOSTING ISSUE the tree will like get out of focus, vibrate, shake, jitter, I say all these words just trying to describe it best i can. But in reality the actual WHOLE SCREEN is doing this issue its just more easyly noticeable in still objects.
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 03:04 PM   #7
neight
Radeon R420
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 238
neight is still being judged by the masses


Default

It's not interlacing, it's motion blur. Here is a 3dfx demo that has 30fps on one half of the screen and 60fps on the other. the 30fps is not as smooth as the 60fps half. you can see if this is what you are seeing.

Download this glide wrapper:
http://www.voodoofiles.com/17172

install, then run the configurator, when the menu loads up, leave it running in the background and launch the demo you DL here:

http://www.falconfly-central.de/down...emo-3060hz.zip

60fps is on the left, 30fps is on the right.
neight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 03:44 PM   #8
Android1
Radeon Polaris 20 XL
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: United States Upper Midwest
Posts: 9,962
Android1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird sings


Default

Tgg, the next time you want to add additional information to an inquiry (think 2 weeks or newer) that has remained replyless, please post it in the original thread.
Android1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 04:18 PM   #9
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Android1 View Post
Tgg, the next time you want to add additional information to an inquiry (think 2 weeks or newer) that has remained replyless, please post it in the original thread.
Will do sorry everyone.......
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 04:18 PM   #10
Android1
Radeon Polaris 20 XL
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: United States Upper Midwest
Posts: 9,962
Android1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird sings


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgg View Post
Will do sorry everyone.......
No problem.
Android1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 04:19 PM   #11
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by neight View Post
It's not interlacing, it's motion blur. Here is a 3dfx demo that has 30fps on one half of the screen and 60fps on the other. the 30fps is not as smooth as the 60fps half. you can see if this is what you are seeing.

Download this glide wrapper:
http://www.voodoofiles.com/17172

install, then run the configurator, when the menu loads up, leave it running in the background and launch the demo you DL here:

http://www.falconfly-central.de/down...emo-3060hz.zip

60fps is on the left, 30fps is on the right.

Ok i'll try this brb.....
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 04:38 PM   #12
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by neight View Post
It's not interlacing, it's motion blur. Here is a 3dfx demo that has 30fps on one half of the screen and 60fps on the other. the 30fps is not as smooth as the 60fps half. you can see if this is what you are seeing.

Download this glide wrapper:
http://www.voodoofiles.com/17172

install, then run the configurator, when the menu loads up, leave it running in the background and launch the demo you DL here:

http://www.falconfly-central.de/down...emo-3060hz.zip

60fps is on the left, 30fps is on the right.
I get a error message " could not run setup.exe" when it starts the extracting proccess.
I'm running vista 64bit premium btw....
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 04:44 PM   #13
Maze
Bazinga!
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Netherlands Holland
Posts: 7,494
Maze is still being judged by the masses


Default

the games you don't see the issue with, are the games that run at 60 fps. I think the problem you have is tearing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_tearing) combined with the fact the games you named have a motion blur when turning the camera. Combine the 2 and you might get that effect. It seems like you are among the people who can easily notice such things. I think there is nothing you can do about it. Like me you have to learn to live with it.

This is all based from the information you gave us. I could be completely wrong though. Isn't it possible for you to make a picture (or even better, a video) of the problem you have.
__________________
Camera: Canon EOS 50D + Tokina 12-24 F4, Tamron 17-50 F2.8, Canon EF 50 F1.8, Canon EF-S 55-250 F4-5.6 IS
Maze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 04:53 PM   #14
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MazeWing View Post
the games you don't see the issue with, are the games that run at 60 fps. I think the problem you have is tearing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_tearing) combined with the fact the games you named have a motion blur when turning the camera. Combine the 2 and you might get that effect. It seems like you are among the people who can easily notice such things. I think there is nothing you can do about it. Like me you have to learn to live with it.

This is all based from the information you gave us. I could be completely wrong though. Isn't it possible for you to make a picture (or even better, a video) of the problem you have.
You know what i think i got to excited about this 30 frames vs 60 frames being the issue. First of all again its not tearing issue, I know what tearing looks like i'm a computer tech got my own bussiness btw, been playing pc gmaes since early 90's i'm 31 years old, so i seen, been, through alot of video cards issues, building gaming pc's for myself, So as you guys know when you play a pc game and if the frames drop lower than whatever you monitors refresh rate is set to then your gonna see tearing, unless you turn on vynsc.

Now i'm new to console gaming on tv displays, so the issue i been describing here isnt tearing. Now I do see tearing in games like uncharted, heavenly sword, god of wars etc. Thanks....
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 05:11 PM   #15
SpeckledJim
Radeon Northern Islands
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,235
SpeckledJim is still being judged by the masses


Default

I could have sworn we went through this here:

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthre...post1335273458
SpeckledJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 05:19 PM   #16
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeckledJim View Post
I could have sworn we went through this here:

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthre...post1335273458
Ok so you said this before to my thread "I'm guessing he's seeing afterimage artefacts, not interlace ones, from games that are running at 30fps or below. The ones that don't exhibit it are running at 60fps."

Now when you say afterimage artifacts what do you exactly mean, is there a picture on the net i can see? Thanks...
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 05:34 PM   #17
SpeckledJim
Radeon Northern Islands
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,235
SpeckledJim is still being judged by the masses


Default

It's not really something that would come across very well in a still image. The 3DFX demo linked above would be the best demonstration, since you need to see it in motion.

It seems to be one of those things that some people are sensitive to, whilst others just don't notice, or if they do, it doesn't bother them.
SpeckledJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 05:39 PM   #18
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeckledJim View Post
It's not really something that would come across very well in a still image. The 3DFX demo linked above would be the best demonstration, since you need to see it in motion.

It seems to be one of those things that some people are sensitive to, whilst others just don't notice, or if they do, it doesn't bother them.
Ok so your not talking about tearing right? damm the 3dfx wont work though...
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 05:55 PM   #19
SpeckledJim
Radeon Northern Islands
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,235
SpeckledJim is still being judged by the masses


Default

No, nothing to do with tearing, and nor is it limited to LCD screens, so it applies equally to your CRT.
SpeckledJim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 30, 2007, 05:59 PM   #20
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeckledJim View Post
No, nothing to do with tearing, and nor is it limited to LCD screens, so it applies equally to your CRT.
Ok until i figure out this 3dfx demo program, What i'm seeing is motion artifacts in only certain games because of why though? Is it because those games run at 30 frames. So it doesnt matter what display you have your going to see this or what? Why do some people say they dont see what i see? The only thing i can think of the eyes/brain arent trained to look for that right?
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 31, 2007, 05:00 AM   #21
Maze
Bazinga!
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Netherlands Holland
Posts: 7,494
Maze is still being judged by the masses


Default

like i said before, it's a combination of 30 fps, tearing and build in motion blur.
__________________
Camera: Canon EOS 50D + Tokina 12-24 F4, Tamron 17-50 F2.8, Canon EF 50 F1.8, Canon EF-S 55-250 F4-5.6 IS
Maze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 31, 2007, 04:57 PM   #22
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MazeWing View Post
like i said before, it's a combination of 30 fps, tearing and build in motion blur.
Ok so have you seen yourself what i'm seeing? Can you and everyone else hear explain to me like I was explaining to you guys, describe to me what you are seeing in your own way/words like if you where me starting this thread.

I want to see if we are talking about the same thing for "SURE"

If this was a known issue all along, I say to myself man that artifact makes the game ugly. Why cant it be perfect like some other games.
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 31, 2007, 05:55 PM   #23
Android1
Radeon Polaris 20 XL
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: United States Upper Midwest
Posts: 9,962
Android1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird singsAndroid1 knows why the caged bird sings


Default

Neight, that will do. Trolling behavior is not acceptable here.
Android1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 1, 2008, 03:18 AM   #24
Maze
Bazinga!
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Netherlands Holland
Posts: 7,494
Maze is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgg View Post
Ok so have you seen yourself what i'm seeing? Can you and everyone else hear explain to me like I was explaining to you guys, describe to me what you are seeing in your own way/words like if you where me starting this thread.

I want to see if we are talking about the same thing for "SURE"

If this was a known issue all along, I say to myself man that artifact makes the game ugly. Why cant it be perfect like some other games.
i don't have the problems you describe here. And i'm also very sensitive to such things. Please post a picture to make it more clear to us.
__________________
Camera: Canon EOS 50D + Tokina 12-24 F4, Tamron 17-50 F2.8, Canon EF 50 F1.8, Canon EF-S 55-250 F4-5.6 IS
Maze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 1, 2008, 09:32 PM   #25
tgg
Radeon R600
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 602
tgg is still being judged by the masses


Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MazeWing View Post
i don't have the problems you describe here. And i'm also very sensitive to such things. Please post a picture to make it more clear to us.
Actually its quite there the motion artifact I'm seeing, even some new people at the forum link I'm going to give you are now seeing it too and they never notice it before now. heres a link and you dont have to read from the very begining of the thread you should be able to start off where I started my name over there is "pctek" Thanks.....

PS go ahead and read each reply you'll learn some thing too....


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=964890
tgg is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
question about shimmering, jittering, combing with some ps3 games..... tgg Console Gaming 6 Dec 30, 2007 05:32 PM
playing ps2 games on my ps3 combing/shimmering issue..... tgg Console Gaming 1 Dec 30, 2007 03:40 PM
question about shimmering, jittering, combing with some ps3 games..... tgg Console Gaming 2 Dec 22, 2007 01:36 PM
question about combing artifacts on my tv with a ps3... tgg Console Gaming 4 Nov 16, 2007 07:59 PM
Difference between adaptive de-interlacing and Smart Select de-interlacing??? Bruce Wayne AMD Radeon Discussion and Support 1 May 25, 2002 09:30 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:45 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All trademarks used are properties of their respective owners. Copyright ©1998-2011 Rage3D.com
Links monetized by VigLink