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Old Jul 8, 2020, 11:09 AM   #301
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KAC
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First game is clearly superior. I don’t think anyone would deny that. However, I had a blast with this one as well. I found the locations etc. flowing organically and flashbacks timely. It is a slow burn so people wanting action all the time are going to be disappointed. Though you can certainly Rambo it, I don’t recommend it.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 11:12 AM   #302
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Originally Posted by SD-[Inc] View Post
The story is first in this game so you won’t like it. If you don’t enjoy storytelling it’s not for you. It’s not super long. But they do try and weave multiple stories together. So it wouldn’t be something you would like.
I do enjoy storytelling very much, but the gameplay has to first and foremost be more engaging and deep.

I slogged through about 10 hours of the first game and just lost interest. Never finished it. I need more interesting and varied gameplay to keep me hooked when the game is more than a few hours long. Wish I could like them and not bashing anyone who does but these games and Uncharted series are just not my thing. Seems more like Naughty Dog wants to make movies than games.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 11:44 AM   #303
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I don’t think everything is an RPG or souls game that you continue to expect new challenges or gameplay types. Even with that said this game has tons of location variety, different weapons, crafting and upgrades to chew on. There are also multiple ways to approach a situation, either through cover, stealth, Rambo with different weapons including bow/arrow, distractions, pipe bombs, melee that you feel that enough thought was given on gameplay as well.

Story remains front and center and yes it has the same issues like any game where you have morality but you end up being a mass murderer through and through just like any action movie etc. at the end of the day it’s all good and certainly a genre of games that I hope more people risk with having linear progression with light exploration and sufficient variety that it plays like a good flick.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 11:50 AM   #304
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Hey like I said I don't find fault in anyone else who enjoys these games.

Its just me, I tend to fall asleep playing them lol.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 12:23 PM   #305
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ok, made it to the hospital. I have to rest the arm for a bit before I go in though.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 01:29 PM   #306
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I've already spent the night in the theater...it isn't the story aspect of it. I love a solid story and fully recognize that's what these games are about. It's the game's pacing and placement of events. It just doesn't feel like it flows as smoothly as the first.

It also might not help that they're already indicated where they're going with this, which is great story telling, but again it's a question of the pace, the when, where and how everything seems to be set to be revealed.

I dunno - it's not a bad game by any stretch of the imagination. It just doesn't hold up well to my memories of the first game .....yet.
They are going to throw a big story telling curveball at you soon. I will be interested to see hear how you take it.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 05:46 PM   #307
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I think I've met the scars? There was another name used for them, so I'm not sure. Lots of whistling, and lots of impaling themselves on my knife and running into stun bombs.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 05:50 PM   #308
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Originally Posted by KAC View Post
I don’t think everything is an RPG or souls game that you continue to expect new challenges or gameplay types. Even with that said this game has tons of location variety, different weapons, crafting and upgrades to chew on. There are also multiple ways to approach a situation, either through cover, stealth, Rambo with different weapons including bow/arrow, distractions, pipe bombs, melee that you feel that enough thought was given on gameplay as well.

Story remains front and center and yes it has the same issues like any game where you have morality but you end up being a mass murderer through and through just like any action movie etc. at the end of the day it’s all good and certainly a genre of games that I hope more people risk with having linear progression with light exploration and sufficient variety that it plays like a good flick.
I agree with you...my problem, and it is literally all my problem is that I have a very difficult time choosing games - I get bored/distracted inside of 5 minutes. That's not any games issue, just mine. I've literally gone over a year without buying, and my library is tiny compared to most folks here.

All that said, doing what you mentioned earlier and speeding through the slow/re-supply parts is helping a lot, so thanks for that. I was mainly worried I would always be out of supplies, but they seem to keep feeding me just enough to get through.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 05:53 PM   #309
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I agree with you...my problem, and it is literally all my problem is that I have a very difficult time choosing games - I get bored/distracted inside of 5 minutes. That's not any games issue, just mine. I've literally gone over a year without buying, and my library is tiny compared to most folks here.
That's because you're a Dark Souls fan. I have the same problem.

All other games pale in comparison to the challenge and depth of Souls.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 06:07 PM   #310
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That's because you're a Dark Souls fan. I have the same problem.

All other games pale in comparison to the challenge and depth of Souls.
Yep, you and I have discussed that before. Soulsborne/Nioh etc are the only game types that really, truly scratch that itch for me.

It kind of sucks sometimes
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 06:41 PM   #311
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I agree with you...my problem, and it is literally all my problem is that I have a very difficult time choosing games - I get bored/distracted inside of 5 minutes. That's not any games issue, just mine. I've literally gone over a year without buying, and my library is tiny compared to most folks here.

All that said, doing what you mentioned earlier and speeding through the slow/re-supply parts is helping a lot, so thanks for that. I was mainly worried I would always be out of supplies, but they seem to keep feeding me just enough to get through.
Just don't miss any of the upgrade magazines. Not all of the skills you can upgrade with the pills are great. But some are pretty useful.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 06:50 PM   #312
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Just don't miss any of the upgrade magazines. Not all of the skills you can upgrade with the pills are great. But some are pretty useful.
most areas are pretty easy to clear once enemies are dealt with, so I'm probably not missing too much. Finding my own pace with the combat is helping a lot too. Everything seems either >90% stealth or hyper-aggressive. I haven't found much in between yet.

I didn't know that NOT aiming a brick/bomb will give you a hit every time. Great for storming multiple enemies.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 06:56 PM   #313
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That's because you're a Dark Souls fan. I have the same problem.

All other games pale in comparison to the challenge and depth of Souls.
I think I am getting too old because I am starting to be the opposite. Souls games seem super repetitive after a short time to me. I get it is all about refining your skills through different sorts of encounters. But, the repetitive nature of learning these skills often make me feel like I am at another job or something. Gotta get better to see more game.... Block, Dodge, Deflect, Light Attack, Strong, Combo, .... Every game is just a rehash of these same basic mechanics. But, I admit there really is a sense of accomplishment to advancing past a tough enemy and I am over simplifying a bit. I don't dislike them. But, I certainly couldn't ONLY play that type of game.

I like the change of pace that comes with jumping into more story driven games. But, I am weird. I actually LOVED Death Stranding for the same reason. In that game it was more about learning what the heck is going on than perfecting gameplay mechanics. I highly suggest you guys NOT play that game though. It would be torture as they feed you nuggets of gameplay information super slowly. And you need to work hard to find and understand anything. I liked that sort of challenge and it was a welcome change of pace for me.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 07:12 PM   #314
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most areas are pretty easy to clear once enemies are dealt with, so I'm probably not missing too much. Finding my own pace with the combat is helping a lot too. Everything seems either >90% stealth or hyper-aggressive. I haven't found much in between yet.

I didn't know that NOT aiming a brick/bomb will give you a hit every time. Great for storming multiple enemies.
Love the brick. I played around with enemy difficulty in New Game+. If you want the action levels to last longer, definitely up the difficulty. Higher difficulty increases the number of enemies, increases how fast they move and react, and increases the general awareness of their surroundings. I found it really hard to play anything but aggressive style on the harder difficulties because it is almost impossible not to be spotted. Difficulty level doesn't affect any achievements or anything that I am aware of. So you can turn it up or down. I love the harder difficulty in open encounters like at the hospital. Not so much in enclosed areas where a bunch of runners and other infected are attacking me from all sides. There is an area you are about to run into with a bloater and a couple of runners in an enclosed space. On survivor difficulty, fricken runners were continuously dropping in from above on me while a bloater was chasing and trying to kill me. Too much insanity for me. I had to drop the difficulty level there... Runners are much faster and attack constantly on highest difficulty settings. It's nearly impossible to dodge when more than one are on you. And with a bloater trying to smash me I needed all the shotgun shells I could carry. I did kill probably 8 to 10 runners and unloaded a full supply of shotgun shells on the bloater. And still had 2-3 runners trying to get me and a pissed off bloater. Yipes! Don't want to go there again!

But, be careful. As changing the difficulty will reset the entire encounter. If you are half-way through killing an area. You will have to start over after you change difficulty. Probably not a problem if you just died because the encounter restarts anyway.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 08:32 PM   #315
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Love the brick. I played around with enemy difficulty in New Game+. If you want the action levels to last longer, definitely up the difficulty. Higher difficulty increases the number of enemies, increases how fast they move and react, and increases the general awareness of their surroundings. I found it really hard to play anything but aggressive style on the harder difficulties because it is almost impossible not to be spotted. Difficulty level doesn't affect any achievements or anything that I am aware of. So you can turn it up or down. I love the harder difficulty in open encounters like at the hospital. Not so much in enclosed areas where a bunch of runners and other infected are attacking me from all sides. There is an area you are about to run into with a bloater and a couple of runners in an enclosed space. On survivor difficulty, fricken runners were continuously dropping in from above on me while a bloater was chasing and trying to kill me. Too much insanity for me. I had to drop the difficulty level there... Runners are much faster and attack constantly on highest difficulty settings. It's nearly impossible to dodge when more than one are on you. And with a bloater trying to smash me I needed all the shotgun shells I could carry. I did kill probably 8 to 10 runners and unloaded a full supply of shotgun shells on the bloater. And still had 2-3 runners trying to get me and a pissed off bloater. Yipes! Don't want to go there again!

But, be careful. As changing the difficulty will reset the entire encounter. If you are half-way through killing an area. You will have to start over after you change difficulty. Probably not a problem if you just died because the encounter restarts anyway.
yeah, I had to lower difficulty a notch. Getting swarmed isn't fun lol.

I'm in the hospital proper now, just cleared all the wlf, which was a nice fight. I'm guessing from KACs comments earlier the scar will pose a challenge in the hospital, so I'm looking forward to that. And hunting Nora, whoever she is.

Nice pacing in the past couple of areas. That last run n gun was fun.
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 09:05 PM   #316
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yeah, I had to lower difficulty a notch. Getting swarmed isn't fun lol.

I'm in the hospital proper now, just cleared all the wlf, which was a nice fight. I'm guessing from KACs comments earlier the scar will pose a challenge in the hospital, so I'm looking forward to that. And hunting Nora, whoever she is.

Nice pacing in the past couple of areas. That last run n gun was fun.
Did you get a scope on that rifle yet? If not, do so as soon as you can...
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 09:08 PM   #317
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Did you get a scope on that rifle yet? If not, do so as soon as you can...
First mod I grabbed when I got in
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 09:41 PM   #318
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An exploding arrow is a good way to deal with a bunch of enemies that are not respecting proper social distancing. Get those when you can too!
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Old Jul 8, 2020, 11:07 PM   #319
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Exploding arrows were dope.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 05:26 AM   #320
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Someone posted a video showing some really advanced gameplay tactics... I'm not gonna spoil the video but there's a few thing and one that really stands out that is just astonishing.

So as for the story in TLoU2... yeah the ending and certain story plotlines decisions about the game do suck... however the first game on PS3 and the remaster which didn't have story edits or any alternate endings or paths also sucked story wise.

I've beaten the first game several times and remember that it wasn't all that great in the story... there were dumb logic decisions and then when Henry's story arc happened it was the most pointless and weak aspect of the game.

Also the hunters/cannibals were not explicitly stated to be cannibals or even part of the same group but they were part of the same group.

The part where Joel falls on the rusty iron bar was just pure bullshit for the plot... it wasn't necessary at all and it could have been written and handled better.

The firefly level at the end also had some story problems... he is being chased by a large number of Fireflies but he has plenty of time to kill for the plot before getting in the car... that could have been fixed with a playable stage.

I could point out many story problems which seemed like the game devs self censored themselves in a way and were able to go further on part two but yeah part two suffers from some bad game design decisions.

The gameplay mechanics system and A.I. enemies is where the game is severely addictive... it's pretty nice that at the very least Naughty Dog's devs focused on only making the single player campaign mode leaving the online mode as a separate game because we'd probably be stuck with a shorter game.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 06:58 AM   #321
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They are going to throw a big story telling curveball at you soon. I will be interested to see hear how you take it.
I've been watching for this - are you talking about Joel finally telling her the truth?

So I've cleared the hospital, easy but fun. What got my attention more than anything else is the amazing job they did conveying Ellies emotional state throughout. Props for that. Her facial expressions are some real time rip your heart out of your chest stuff.

To be perfectly honest though, I was expecting a lot more out of that level given comments here

So Seattle day 3 has officially started....
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 09:01 AM   #322
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I think I am getting too old because I am starting to be the opposite. Souls games seem super repetitive after a short time to me. I get it is all about refining your skills through different sorts of encounters. But, the repetitive nature of learning these skills often make me feel like I am at another job or something. Gotta get better to see more game.... Block, Dodge, Deflect, Light Attack, Strong, Combo, .... Every game is just a rehash of these same basic mechanics. But, I admit there really is a sense of accomplishment to advancing past a tough enemy and I am over simplifying a bit. I don't dislike them. But, I certainly couldn't ONLY play that type of game.



I like the change of pace that comes with jumping into more story driven games. But, I am weird. I actually LOVED Death Stranding for the same reason. In that game it was more about learning what the heck is going on than perfecting gameplay mechanics. I highly suggest you guys NOT play that game though. It would be torture as they feed you nuggets of gameplay information super slowly. And you need to work hard to find and understand anything. I liked that sort of challenge and it was a welcome change of pace for me.
I'm really looking forward to playing Death Stranding next week. I appreciate different games that give a unique experience, and I just by default always play everything Kojima makes since he's my all time favorite game designer.

I of course play other games than Souls-likes, but the problem I was referring to is I constantly feel myself always comparing game mechanics to what From Software did with the Souls games. Thats what over 1000 combined hours in Souls games will do I guess. But they just took 3rd person advanced action mechanics and character building to another level and seems like all other game genres need to catch up.

Now if a game can combine the depth of Souls gameplay with the story of Last of Us that would be something special.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 10:19 AM   #323
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Finished it, loved it.

A lot of people obviously don't feel the same way. Whether that's [spoilers]pacing, gameplay cycle, Joel's demise, playing as Abby, or deciding not to be consumed by revenge entirely[/spoilers], I suppose you could have a negative reaction to those things. I don't see what all the supposed SJW commotion was about - Ellie is gay and always has been, so any relation she'd take interest in as a teenager is going to at least be gay as well. Not an issue at all, and I feel the game handled it in the same manner it would any straight relationship. Kudos to Naughty Dog for writing characters that aren't standard normies - the Gordon Freemans and Master Chiefs of this world have plenty of their own games.

But there's no single level I wouldn't gladly replay, no single encounter where I was annoyed for having to play it over again. It's all typical TLOU: it's harsh, it's unforgiving, it's unsettling, and that's exactly why I loved both these games.

My personal biggest criticism would be that its overall story pacing is uneven. It's a bit like there being one more episode to a season than you thought there was.

Would've been my GOTY so far if it weren't for Alyx.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 12:29 PM   #324
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I've been watching for this - are you talking about Joel finally telling her the truth?

So I've cleared the hospital, easy but fun. What got my attention more than anything else is the amazing job they did conveying Ellies emotional state throughout. Props for that. Her facial expressions are some real time rip your heart out of your chest stuff.

To be perfectly honest though, I was expecting a lot more out of that level given comments here

So Seattle day 3 has officially started....
Hmm well if that didn’t catch your attention then maybe when you hit the hospital again it might. Are you playing on pussy difficulty?
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 12:46 PM   #325
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Hmm well if that didn’t catch your attention then maybe when you hit the hospital again it might. Are you playing on pussy difficulty?
Maybe you just aren't that good at playing a murderous 16 year old girl.


I'll check - Been playing on hard, lowered it a level...I think when the scars were introduced, because I was getting killed and couldn't figure out where I was being sniped from, and I don't remember if I turned it back up or not.

Survivor I may try if I do NG+. Right now all the twitch and a few jumps are being really hard on the arm/shoulder...so I might just leave on moderate or whereever it's at now. Which is pretty easy.

Seriously, hyper aggressive gameplay takes a lot of the challenge out of levels. Just don't miss.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 02:34 PM   #326
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Originally Posted by Lazy8s View Post
I've been watching for this - are you talking about Joel finally telling her the truth?

So I've cleared the hospital, easy but fun. What got my attention more than anything else is the amazing job they did conveying Ellies emotional state throughout. Props for that. Her facial expressions are some real time rip your heart out of your chest stuff.

To be perfectly honest though, I was expecting a lot more out of that level given comments here

So Seattle day 3 has officially started....
Nope. That’s not the curveball. You will know it when you see it.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 02:40 PM   #327
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Nope. That’s not the curveball. You will know it when you see it.
Looking forward to it.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 02:55 PM   #328
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Maybe you just aren't that good at playing a murderous 16 year old girl.


I'll check - Been playing on hard, lowered it a level...I think when the scars were introduced, because I was getting killed and couldn't figure out where I was being sniped from, and I don't remember if I turned it back up or not.

Survivor I may try if I do NG+. Right now all the twitch and a few jumps are being really hard on the arm/shoulder...so I might just leave on moderate or whereever it's at now. Which is pretty easy.

Seriously, hyper aggressive gameplay takes a lot of the challenge out of levels. Just don't miss.
Moderate is still fun but the enemies are much smarter And tougher on Hard. I think they cheat on Survivor so I preferred Hard myself. Once you start to feel like an encounter was too easy, bump it up again. They put a LOT of work into addressing the difficulty levels. There are probably like 16 different parameters that change when you change difficulty. Just off of the top of my head, they include things like: Enemy damage, enemy speed, enemy aggressiveness, enemy number, competence of your allies, how quickly enemies alert other enemies, availability of ammo, enemy awareness of surroundings, enemy grab mechanics, enemy attack speed, enemy vision, dog sensing abilities,... Difficulty dramatically changes the game. It’s really cool that in NewGame+ they give you the ability to tweak all of these different settings and create custom difficulty levels. I have had a lot of fun playing around with the settings and learning how it affects the game. It gave me a whole new respect for anyone that can beat the game using survivor mode. I honestly don’t know how they do it. I played for a while with enemy and stealth set to survivor+ and could rarely even sneak in a bow headshot without the entire enemy going into full red alert. Flanking and rushing me with melee while pinning me down with long rifles. Miss just one shot and you die. (I miss a lot). It was pretty impressive stuff. At times I felt they were too good as they never miss and just barrage you with attacks. The settings are supposed to be even more aggressive in NewGame+ so maybe Survivor isn’t as insane in the regular game. But i do have my full supply of upgraded weapons too.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 03:05 PM   #329
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Moderate is still fun but the enemies are much smarter And tougher on Hard. I think they cheat on Survivor so I preferred Hard myself. Once you start to feel like an encounter was too easy, bump it up again. They put a LOT of work into addressing the difficulty levels. There are probably like 16 different parameters that change when you change difficulty. Just off of the top of my head, they include things like: Enemy damage, enemy speed, enemy aggressiveness, enemy number, competence of your allies, how quickly enemies alert other enemies, availability of ammo, enemy awareness of surroundings, enemy grab mechanics, enemy attack speed, enemy vision, dog sensing abilities,... Difficulty dramatically changes the game. It’s really cool that in NewGame+ they give you the ability to tweak all of these different settings and create custom difficulty levels. I have had a lot of fun playing around with the settings and learning how it affects the game. It gave me a whole new respect for anyone that can beat the game using survivor mode. I honestly don’t know how they do it. I played for a while with enemy and stealth set to survivor+ and could rarely even sneak in a bow headshot without the entire enemy going into full red alert. Flanking and rushing me with melee while pinning me down with long rifles. Miss just one shot and you die. (I miss a lot). It was pretty impressive stuff. At times I felt they were too good as they never miss and just barrage you with attacks. The settings are supposed to be even more aggressive in NewGame+ so maybe Survivor isn’t as insane in the regular game. But i do have my full supply of upgraded weapons too.
I did check and yep, had it on moderate from the first scar encounter. When you get hit with that first arrow - right after that I tried to cover in 2-3 different locations not realizing there's an open area to the left and above that gave them a clear line of sight on me. And I couldn't get up there without dying.

And yes, the difference between the levels is incredible. I went full bore attack in the hospital, no stealth at all, and maybe it was one of those rare freak encounters where it all just came together, but it was pretty easy. Intense, but not challenging. It seems that constantly throwing bottles/bombs/bricks to distract while rushing baffles the AI for a few seconds. I'll find out I'm sure in the next area, where I'm switching back to hard, just got to where the scar ambush the boat full of wlf soldiers on the river

Crossing open water against an elevated enemy is probably going to wreck my calm. We'll see.
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Old Jul 9, 2020, 03:36 PM   #330
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I did check and yep, had it on moderate from the first scar encounter. When you get hit with that first arrow - right after that I tried to cover in 2-3 different locations not realizing there's an open area to the left and above that gave them a clear line of sight on me. And I couldn't get up there without dying.

And yes, the difference between the levels is incredible. I went full bore attack in the hospital, no stealth at all, and maybe it was one of those rare freak encounters where it all just came together, but it was pretty easy. Intense, but not challenging. It seems that constantly throwing bottles/bombs/bricks to distract while rushing baffles the AI for a few seconds. I'll find out I'm sure in the next area, where I'm switching back to hard, just got to where the scar ambush the boat full of wlf soldiers on the river

Crossing open water against an elevated enemy is probably going to wreck my calm. We'll see.
The encounter is pretty easy because there aren’t that many of them. Just be sure and use the environment to your advantage and you can take them down easy.
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