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-   -   “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” (http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33919231)

sygnus21 Mar 21, 2008 11:30 PM

“Display driver stopped responding and has recovered”
 
Hmmm…was hoping the “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” problem would be fixed with the release of SP1, but after a clean install of Vista Ultimate x64, SP1, and pristine driver installs on a non overclocked system….the error still pops up. Alrighty then:hmm:

And for those that don’t think this is a "problem", have a look here, here, and here, Microsoft’s fix, which obviously was pre SP1, cause when I tried it I got “This update does not apply to your system” notification box!

This appears to be an equal opportunist problem with regards to video card manufacturers, but not to OS's as it only seems to strike Vista.

And yes this problem was there with Vista Ultimate 32 bit, even with the beta release of SP1 installed on my machine.

caveman-jim Mar 22, 2008 12:33 AM

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33909665

sygnus21 Mar 22, 2008 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caveman-jim (Post 1335397153)

LOL. I nearly choked on my glass of wine when I read this:

"Thank you for providing us with an update on your issue.

Please note that the Radeon HD 2900 XT requires specialized 2x3 and 2x4 Molex connectors provided by specific power supplies as outlined by Radeon HD 2900 XT - System Requirements. Unfortunately, we are unable to support a system with a non ATI Certified Power Supply and Case.

We recommend that you test your product in another system and confirm that the product is functional. If the system is not functional

We appreciate your assistance. Thank you.

Thank you for choosing AMD!"

AMD Global Customer Care for ATI products"

Man that's funny. LOL.

But back to my issue at hand...everything is updated, properly configured, and properly cooled. I also need to state that I only have this problem when playing games. Any game! Today while playing HL2-EP1, I got the error 3 times, at various time periods - 30 minutes to an hour into the game. Also got this in FEAR, Portal, TimeShift wouldn't even get past the beginning of the first level without giving me this error; wound up returning that game.

At first I thought It might have something to do with my slightly overclocked system, but now that i'm on a fresh install of Vista 64, with no overclocking at all, I still get that darn error. I honestly think this is a Vista specific problem that has yet to be addressed. Nvidia folks really have it bad from some of the post I've read in the links I've provided. I'm at a loss right now.

PS...only running one display...a 19" Dell CRT.

Low&Slow Mar 22, 2008 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sygnus21 (Post 1335397205)
LOL. I nearly choked on my glass of wine when I read this:

"Thank you for providing us with an update on your issue.

Please note that the Radeon HD 2900 XT requires specialized 2x3 and 2x4 Molex connectors provided by specific power supplies as outlined by Radeon HD 2900 XT - System Requirements. Unfortunately, we are unable to support a system with a non ATI Certified Power Supply and Case.

We recommend that you test your product in another system and confirm that the product is functional. If the system is not functional

We appreciate your assistance. Thank you.

Thank you for choosing AMD!"

AMD Global Customer Care for ATI products"

Man that's funny. LOL.

But back to my issue at hand...everything is updated, properly configured, and properly cooled. I also need to state that I only have this problem when playing games. Any game! Today while playing HL2-EP1, I got the error 3 times, at various time periods - 30 minutes to an hour into the game. Also got this in FEAR, Portal, TimeShift wouldn't even get past the beginning of the first level without giving me this error; wound up returning that game.

At first I thought It might have something to do with my slightly overclocked system, but now that i'm on a fresh install of Vista 64, with no overclocking at all, I still get that darn error. I honestly think this is a Vista specific problem that has yet to be addressed. Nvidia folks really have it bad from some of the post I've read in the links I've provided. I'm at a loss right now.

PS...only running one display...a 19" Dell CRT.

I only seem to get this error playing Crysis and I am on Xp64, if I turn up the fan speed using Riva tuner then the problem seems to go away.:confused:

Danny Nissan Mar 22, 2008 09:38 AM

Sounds like heating issues to me..

Is your case ventilated well and all? Try opening the side of your case and play Crysis again and see if it still does that :)

sygnus21 Mar 22, 2008 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny Nissan (Post 1335397396)
Sounds like heating issues to me..

Is your case ventilated well and all? Try opening the side of your case and play Crysis again and see if it still does that :)

If it's a heating issue, quite a few folks have this problem, even folk on our own forum here. Maybe we all need new cases:lol:.

On the other hand, there is an issue with low running fans on some of the BBA (Built By ATI) cards, which CAN lead to overheating, but there's a "fanfix" BIOS floating around that fixes this problem...I know this because I installed it on my card. Nooo, this isn't the cause of the “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” problems. Just in case that was your next thought.:) You can read about the "fanfix" BIOS on our very own forum here

Low&Slow Mar 22, 2008 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny Nissan (Post 1335397396)
Sounds like heating issues to me..

Is your case ventilated well and all? Try opening the side of your case and play Crysis again and see if it still does that :)

No heating issues on my side, my case is a cooler master cosmos which runs very cool. One issue seems to be the gpu fan not speeding up during gaming. However the vpu recover only occurs during Crysis.:confused:

Humus Mar 22, 2008 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sygnus21 (Post 1335397098)
This appears to be an equal opportunist problem with regards to video card manufacturers, but not to OS's as it only seems to strike Vista.

Yes, it's Vista specific. Vista has a time-out for graphics operations. IIRC it's two seconds (but can be configured with a registry hack to be longer if necccesary). If any operation takes longer than that, Vista assumes that the video card/driver hung and resets it. The idea is to keep the system running, whereas on XP in the same situation you'd just find that your system froze.

sygnus21 Mar 22, 2008 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Humus (Post 1335397601)
Yes, it's Vista specific. Vista has a time-out for graphics operations. IIRC it's two seconds (but can be configured with a registry hack to be longer if necccesary). If any operation takes longer than that, Vista assumes that the video card/driver hung and resets it. The idea is to keep the system running, whereas on XP in the same situation you'd just find that your system froze.

So is this going to be fixed by MS, seeing that its doing more harm then good? Also do you have a link or something to confirm this?

Thanks.

binormalkilla Mar 23, 2008 12:27 AM

I started getting driver resets with either SP1 or Catalyst 8.2.....not sure which. I originally thought it was just my OC being unstable (950 MHz on each GPU), but this was always stable before.......I ran the Crysis bench something like 15 times to test for stability at first.


It's not sure a big deal (besides being annoying), but in Crossfire it seems that CF is disabled, or one of the cards is switched to 2D clocks, as the temps revert to idle-esque. I monitor all my temps (including GPUs and video card VRMs) on my G15 keyboard's LCD via Everest........

ZeBool Mar 23, 2008 03:25 AM

I get this same error on Vista 32 with a X1800XT. I have the card watercooled, and it rarely breaks 50C under full load. XP has no VPU recovery issues, but Vista will do it usually once or twice just using the desktop, and god forbid I try to play a game. That's apparently against the rules or something, because the VPU recovery events happen once every couple of minutes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sygnus21 (Post 1335397610)
So is this going to be fixed by MS, seeing that its doing more harm then good? Also do you have a link or something to confirm this?

Thanks.

It's part of WDDM. http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device...m_timeout.mspx

Looks like if you set TdrLevel to 0, it should stop.

DigitalSin Mar 23, 2008 06:26 AM

No need to bring-on the fanboi GPU bashing :drool:
I had more GPU restarts with the NVidia card I got rid of, than I ever get with this 3870. Seems like the NV would do it for no reason, whereas this 3870 will do it to me if there is an incompatibility with a gfx engine (i.e. Rappelz 4 w/ Adaptive AA is %100 reproducible VPU restart).

M$ dropped the ball here. In OSX [10.4+] the GPU restart is actually useful and only occurs when the program is actually locked-up, whereas on Vista it seems far too aggressive from my experience. This is regardless of GPU manufacturer...

Oh yea, +1 ZeBool :)

sygnus21 Mar 23, 2008 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZeBool (Post 1335398128)
It's part of WDDM. http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device...m_timeout.mspx

Looks like if you set TdrLevel to 0, it should stop.

Very interesting reading; strange that a lot of users report this problem even without game play; I on the other hand “only” get this problem when I play games, that’s it.

I’m also struck by this note (warning?) to software venders:

“Ensure that the DirectX graphics application does not run at a low frames per second (FPS) rate. As the FPS decreases, the likelihood of the GPU getting reset increases. If the application is running at 10 FPS or lower and a complex graphics operation is about to start, then a flush can be inserted.”

This certainly says a lot about the DirectX requirements for FPS with regards to the TDR model Vista uses, which if not followed, will (is) definitely cause (ing) problems. It seems to me that we are seeing this with older games right now under Vista, and, some early newer games (Crysis), but it’d be interesting to see how the game that’s are coming out in the near future perform under Vista?… but that’s another topic all together. Right now, we’d like to get the “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” problem fixed!

I think Microsoft, with the help of software and hardware vendors, needs take a real hard look at their TDR model under Vista and get this issue sorted or patched out. As of now, this is a major pain in the butt for the end users. I had hoped this would have been resolved under SP1; it seems it hasn’t.

Thanks for the link ZoBool

sygnus21 Mar 23, 2008 02:33 PM

Breakdown of TDR crashes.
 
Found some more interesting information on the TDR crashes. What’s even more interesting is the pie chart breakdown on the causes of those crashes. I’ve provided the numbers here for you and listed them from the highest to lowest percentages.

Top user activities triggering GPU hang detection:
Other interactive apps – 38%
Desktop refresh – 30%
Games – 19%
Video playback – 11%
Benchmarking apps – 2%

This information is compiled from Microsoft’s OCA (Online Crash Analysis) data for Window Vista – (Those error boxes that ask if you want to submit to Microsoft :))

Of the 5 categories, gaming comes in 3rd. That was surprises to me, as I’ve never had a GPU crash with anything other then games.

If you want to read the entire text document, you can download it from here "GPU Hang Detection and Recovery", its short reading.

nanohead Mar 23, 2008 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Low&Slow (Post 1335397386)
I only seem to get this error playing Crysis and I am on Xp64, if I turn up the fan speed using Riva tuner then the problem seems to go away.:confused:

Sounds way too familiar to me. I had exactly the same issue with X64/SP1 and Crysis. A couple of other games too (Bioshock, Prey), but not Source powered games (Half Life, Portal,etc).

I solved it by installing 32bit Vista, after trying EVERYTHING known the human and alien races. DirectX updates, Driver updates, OS reloads (over and over), 1 GPU, 2, and 3. Nothing fixed it. I tried Crysis with Patch 1.1, and 1.2. I swapped hard disks, CPUs, memory. Even motherboards. No worky...

I'm convinced that there is some deep problem with Crysis in general. There are consistent problems with that game and lots O' folks computers.

I also had other issues with 64Bit Vista as well, lots of things not working right (sound drivers come to mind), as well as several other pieces of software.

While I really liked the stability of Vista 64, it had too many violent reactions with too many games. Might be the Cats, might be Microsoft's silly kernel "protection" routines, could be the compatibility stuff built in to handle 32 bit code, could be Elvis from the afterlife with Bigfoot. Who knows.

For now at least, I'm having a stable time with 32bit Vista

ZeBool Mar 23, 2008 06:12 PM

Point of interest: XP video drivers will work in Vista, but you won't get Aero features or DX10. What you'll gain, on the other hand, is a non-WDDM driver that won't suffer from those issues, and the ability to run Win32 console and DOS stuff full screen.

sygnus21 Mar 23, 2008 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nanohead (Post 1335398382)
Sounds way too familiar to me. I had exactly the same issue with X64/SP1 and Crysis. A couple of other games too (Bioshock, Prey), but not Source powered games (Half Life, Portal,etc).

I solved it by installing 32bit Vista, after trying EVERYTHING known the human and alien races. DirectX updates, Driver updates, OS reloads (over and over), 1 GPU, 2, and 3. Nothing fixed it. I tried Crysis with Patch 1.1, and 1.2. I swapped hard disks, CPUs, memory. Even motherboards. No worky...

I'm convinced that there is some deep problem with Crysis in general. There are consistent problems with that game and lots O' folks computers.

I also had other issues with 64Bit Vista as well, lots of things not working right (sound drivers come to mind), as well as several other pieces of software.

While I really liked the stability of Vista 64, it had too many violent reactions with too many games. Might be the Cats, might be Microsoft's silly kernel "protection" routines, could be the compatibility stuff built in to handle 32 bit code, could be Elvis from the afterlife with Bigfoot. Who knows.

For now at least, I'm having a stable time with 32bit Vista

Well I ran Vista 32bit and had the recovering GPU problems, even with Steam games. Did a fresh upgrade to 64bit and the problem is still there. I did however find that the GPU errors are less frequent with all the desktop eye candy turned off. Yeah I know most of you probably do this anyway, but I've never done it till now, even when I first played the HL2 series games.

As for Crysis, I haven't gotten the game yet so I can't speak on its issues.

LingPanda Apr 8, 2008 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sygnus21 (Post 1335397098)
Hmmm…was hoping the “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” problem would be fixed with the release of SP1, but after a clean install of Vista Ultimate x64, SP1, and pristine driver installs on a non overclocked system….the error still pops up. Alrighty then:hmm:

And for those that don’t think this is a "problem", have a look here, here, and here, Microsoft’s fix, which obviously was pre SP1, cause when I tried it I got “This update does not apply to your system” notification box!

This appears to be an equal opportunist problem with regards to video card manufacturers, but not to OS's as it only seems to strike Vista.

And yes this problem was there with Vista Ultimate 32 bit, even with the beta release of SP1 installed on my machine.

Up the voltage on your memory or replace them. I had the exact same problem.

sygnus21 Apr 9, 2008 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LingPanda (Post 1335417083)
Up the voltage on your memory or replace them. I had the exact same problem.

Your suggested fix has no affect on this issue. Incidentally, I had to replace my RAM because of a bad stick, but that did absolutely nothing for the “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” issue. Also, since I use performance memory, the voltage was already "upped". This problem IS NOT a memory issue!!! It's a Vista TDR issue.

Thanks

the_mup Apr 9, 2008 05:32 AM

I only get this when I try to overclock my cards and in crossfire mode. I can overclock each card by itself perfectly.

Another funny thing vista does is tell me that the program i just closed has stopped responding. rofl

sygnus21 Apr 9, 2008 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_mup (Post 1335417360)
I only get this when I try to overclock my cards and in crossfire mode. I can overclock each card by itself perfectly.

Another funny thing vista does is tell me that the program i just closed has stopped responding. rofl

Seeing how sensitive Vista is with regards to video cards and it's TDR design, that's not a surprise! The surprise is that this happens with cards at stock speeds!!! Look through the links provided in my original post.

I think its a coding issue between the video card drivers, DX10, and Vista's TDR design. Look at the stats I gathered from Microsoft, and you'll see that this issue (under Vista) occurs in all sorts of environments...not just gaming.

Top user activities triggering GPU hang detection:
Other interactive apps – 38%
Desktop refresh – 30%
Games – 19%
Video playback – 11%
Benchmarking apps – 2%

Again, these stats are just from Vista!

Burn Apr 12, 2008 01:09 PM

Quote:

Hmmm…was hoping the “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” problem would be fixed with the release of SP1, but after a clean install of Vista Ultimate x64, SP1, and pristine driver installs on a non overclocked system….the error still pops up. Alrighty then:hmm:
i had this problem too , but for me the official 8.3 + 8.3 Hotfix has resolved this issue. With certain games it was impossible to play higher than 820Mhz .. now i can do 875Mhz without VPU's..

sygnus21 Apr 12, 2008 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burn (Post 1335421051)
i had this problem too , but for me the official 8.3 + 8.3 Hotfix has resolved this issue. With certain games it was impossible to play higher than 820Mhz .. now i can do 875Mhz without VPU's..

Well I gave these hot fix drivers a try, hoping that they would cure my “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” problem…and they did…by hard locking my system after about 30 minutes of playing FEAR – Perseus Mandate, requiring a hard reboot.

Went back to the regular 8.3 drivers and the computer works as normal, it even has it's customary “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” error when playing games…but hey, at least no hard lockups. Yeah (sarcasm)

I originally posted this here

Burn Apr 12, 2008 05:11 PM

Quote:

hoping that they would cure my “Display driver stopped responding and has recovered” problem…and they did…by hard locking my system after about 30 minutes of playing FEAR
well .. it sucks..

im sure you have already checked .. but what was the gpu temp just before it crashed ?

sygnus21 Apr 13, 2008 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burn (Post 1335421264)
well .. it sucks..

im sure you have already checked .. but what was the gpu temp just before it crashed ?

I haven't checked, but I'm guessing 70ish. That's what it was the last time I checked, when I was getting problems in timeshift, which I never could run and wound up returning the game. As far as FEAR-Perseus Mandate, I've played this game before, with the same card, and had no issues. Now with these drivers, I get the display stopped responding error. I'm beginning to think this is an ATI driver issue.

JHoff80 Apr 14, 2008 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZeBool (Post 1335398128)
Looks like if you set TdrLevel to 0, it should stop.

I changed this registry setting last night, and haven't had the issue yet, I'll let you know in a couple days if it worked for sure though, thanks.

sygnus21 Apr 15, 2008 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHoff80 (Post 1335422747)
I changed this registry setting last night, and haven't had the issue yet, I'll let you know in a couple days if it worked for sure though, thanks.

Hmmm....Where did you find this (TdrLevel) setting? Because I couldn't find it...even doing a registry search. I'm running Vista Ultimate 32 SP1. Did SP1 remove/hide it?

JHoff80 Apr 15, 2008 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sygnus21 (Post 1335424372)
Hmmm....Where did you find this (TdrLevel) setting? Because I couldn't find it...even doing a registry search. I'm running Vista Ultimate 32 SP1. Did SP1 remove/hide it?

You have to make the key yourself, the other thread listed early on in this one has a link to a reg file on another forum to do it with. However, I'm not entirely sure its fixed or not. I went to sleep last night, and today went to wake my computer from sleep and it had locked up. I'm not sure its related or not because I wasn't on the computer at the time, but its worth noting. Also, I have had a couple of "stopped responding" messages, but not the problem of 4 of them and then a BSOD quite yet.

sygnus21 Apr 15, 2008 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHoff80 (Post 1335424841)
You have to make the key yourself, the other thread listed early on in this one has a link to a reg file on another forum to do it with. However, I'm not entirely sure its fixed or not. I went to sleep last night, and today went to wake my computer from sleep and it had locked up. I'm not sure its related or not because I wasn't on the computer at the time, but its worth noting. Also, I have had a couple of "stopped responding" messages, but not the problem of 4 of them and then a BSOD quite yet.

Yeah, that's what I figured after I got off the phone with Microsoft's tech support concerning the stopped responding issue. That was a complete waste of time; they basically want to push it off on the video card vendor(s). At any rate when I asked about those strings, they puckered up like I was asking for the keys to Fort Knox. Anyways they did confirm that those strings weren't on any of their vista machines either; and looking over that talking paper again gave me the impression they had to be created. I am however still awaiting a response back from a tech support supervisor. We'll see.

As a side note, I switched back to a Sapphire "fan fix" BIOS I had for my card and the "stopped responding" errors seems to have slowed quite a bit. This BIOS seems to be more stable then the official ATI BIOS I posted about here for my system. At least I can play a game for longer then 10-15 minutes without a crash now. I played a HL2 Mod for about an hour and just got one crash. This same game gave me like 3 or 4 crashes within the same frame before switching BIOS'. Next up... FEAR - Perseus Mandate, the real "stopped responding" producer for me.

Thanks

Phanstern Apr 16, 2008 09:59 AM

Before the catalyst 8.3 & hotfix came out, I was getting VPU recovers. Now with 8.3 & hotfix it no longer recovers, certain games just stop responding...Im hoping a future driver will fix this, as its getting OLD!


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